German Cars

[jackbadger]

I DO love German cars, so this hurts


http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700

[Toby Ponsenby]

On Wed, 11 May 2005 08:05:51 -0400, jackbadger wrote:

> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>
>
> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700

Evidently, so does the author loove Cherman cars..

"The E-Class now has computer driven brakes, suspension, transmission,
safety systems, cruise control, navigation - you name it. They're
great when they work but the problem is they sometimes don't. The
slightest disturbance to a control unit, sensor or connection can
render the relevant system inoperative and useless."

Who failed to mention that it's same-same with computers for Lexus and
the other Toyota products, which eat the mercs for breakfast in the
reliability stakes:-)

--
Toby.
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur

[sheik yerbouti]

On Wed, 11 May 2005 08:05:51 -0400, "jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com>
wrote:

>I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>
>http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700
>
>
it's unfair. german cars have so many things packed into them, of
course they're going to fail more regularly.

if you want reliability, go back to the days of 2 step wipers, an AM
radio and 3 on the tree.

---
sheik's auto service centre
88 Wilsons Rd Doncaster 3108
(03) 8855 8077, http://www.freewebs.com/sheik_yerbouti
specialising in transmission service
5% discount if you say you saw us on aus.cars

[FRAN]

jackbadger wrote:
> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>
>
> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700

>From the article ...

"It seems that the German manufacturers, in their intense battle to
stay competitive with each other, have rushed their design and
engineering processes and the implementation of new technology, to the
point where its reliability and durability are not being thoroughly
tested."

It's shocking to think that competition, instead of leading to higher
quality, as common sense dictates, merely leads to uniformity and an
accompanying generalisation of mediocrity.

Who could have foreseen that?

FRAN

[The Interceptor]

Not really a big surprise that the Japanese still build the most reliable
cars (and now Koreans it seems). I've always maintained that they produce
well-built cars. Unfortunately this is not always associated with the most
desirable cars.

I've got this impression that German engineering can be very impressive, but
sometimes they don't do things in the simplest way possible. When you don't
do it in the simplest way, you open up ways for things to go wrong.

Brett

jackbadger <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0ea9c9536c9b893fa55455dc5d3c566f@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>
>
> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700
>
>
>

[Bernd Felsche]

"FRAN" <fran_beta@hotmail.com> writes:
>jackbadger wrote:
>> I DO love German cars, so this hurts

>> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700

>>From the article ...

>"It seems that the German manufacturers, in their intense battle to
>stay competitive with each other, have rushed their design and
>engineering processes and the implementation of new technology, to the
>point where its reliability and durability are not being thoroughly
>tested."

>It's shocking to think that competition, instead of leading to higher
>quality, as common sense dictates, merely leads to uniformity and an
>accompanying generalisation of mediocrity.

>Who could have foreseen that?

But the customers "wanted" all the whizz-bang stuff.
--
/"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
\ / ASCII ribbon campaign | I'm a .signature virus!
X against HTML mail | Copy me into your ~/.signature
/ \ and postings | to help me spread!

[Phuoc Nghuy]

On Wed, 11 May 2005 05:47:28 -0700, FRAN wrote:


> It's shocking to think that competition, instead of leading to higher
> quality, as common sense dictates, merely leads to uniformity and an
> accompanying generalisation of mediocrity.
>
> Who could have foreseen that?

Likely it is not market driven mediocrity. It is the result of firmware fuckups
resulting from insufficient testing.

It is likely that the Japanese take a more rigorous approach to testing
their firmware.

Phuoc

[Jason James]

"Phuoc Nghuy" <Phuoc412@cloaca.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2005.05.11.17.28.58.914567@cloaca.com...
> On Wed, 11 May 2005 05:47:28 -0700, FRAN wrote:
>
>
> > It's shocking to think that competition, instead of leading to higher
> > quality, as common sense dictates, merely leads to uniformity and an
> > accompanying generalisation of mediocrity.
> >
> > Who could have foreseen that?
>
> Likely it is not market driven mediocrity. It is the result of firmware
fuckups
> resulting from insufficient testing.
>
> It is likely that the Japanese take a more rigorous approach to testing
> their firmware.
>
> Phuoc

The more electronics the greater the scope for intermittant problems and
failures. There is a common-sense limit to how much software driven
facilities are needed. Leave the non-critical stuff to the uProcessor design
nuts with the exception of EFI/ ignition control.

Jason

[rmcgrice]

"jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in
news:0ea9c9536c9b893fa55455dc5d3c566f@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com:

> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>
>
> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700

I think it's hillarious :-)
Most on this group knock Jaguar... LOL

"Among individual nameplates, Lexus won - it does every year - followed by
Cadillac and Jaguar, a big improver. Last place went to Hummer, followed by
Volkswagen and Porsche. Volkswagen and Mercedes-Benz also rate well below
average in JD Powers' annual Vehicle Dependability Study, which looks at
problems in three-year-old cars."

Regards,
Ron

[Dan---]

"jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0ea9c9536c9b893fa55455dc5d3c566f@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>
>
> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700

I also like German cars but I have been saying this for a few years German
built cars are grossly over hyped. They use to build excellent cars and
Mercedes Benz in the early 70's to late 90's were built like a tank. People
rag on locally built cars because they have problems now the big G mobiles
are not much better really.



--
Regards Dan
I dont use comindico ISP's.

[Clockmeister]

"Dan---" <nospa)m@203.61.241.14.com> wrote in message
news:428278d0$0$26818$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> "jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:0ea9c9536c9b893fa55455dc5d3c566f@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
> > I DO love German cars, so this hurts
> >
> >
> > http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700
>
> I also like German cars but I have been saying this for a few years German
> built cars are grossly over hyped. They use to build excellent cars and
> Mercedes Benz in the early 70's to late 90's were built like a tank.
People
> rag on locally built cars because they have problems now the big G mobiles
> are not much better really.
>

When you factor in the sheer amount of gadgetry, safety engineering and
developmental technology in the German cars compared to the local stuff you
quickly find out how shithouse our own cars really are.

The Japs only perfect what others have engineered and developed and choose
the safe and boring options so reliability is much easier to achieve.

[Michael C]

"Clockmeister" <no-one@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:42828881@duster.adelaide.on.net...
> The Japs only perfect what others have engineered and developed and choose
> the safe and boring options so reliability is much easier to achieve.

Did they do that with lexus?

Michael

[Dan---]

"Clockmeister" <no-one@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:42828881@duster.adelaide.on.net...
>

> >
>
> When you factor in the sheer amount of gadgetry, safety engineering and
> developmental technology in the German cars compared to the local stuff
you
> quickly find out how shithouse our own cars really are.

Thats true in the scheme of things there but then again we not as worse off
as we think. Technology is excellent but only if its reliable and not a PITA
and its useable. No point pissing money away on a car that has the most
gizmo's and its as reliable as a Lada Samara. :-)
>
> The Japs only perfect what others have engineered and developed and choose
> the safe and boring options so reliability is much easier to achieve.

Yup i'd have a 2nd hand Lexus over a new Mercedes or BMW in the same range
of luxury. But today cars should not be boring or unreliable. Half the shit
I see in cars in the technology field I wouldn't use like a vibrating cup
holder or solar powered pen. :-)

Although if you live in europe european are dime a dozen compared to here.
--
Regards Dan
I dont use comindico ISP's.

[ant]

Bernd Felsche wrote:
> "FRAN" <fran_beta@hotmail.com> writes:
>> It's shocking to think that competition, instead of leading to higher
>> quality, as common sense dictates, merely leads to uniformity and an
>> accompanying generalisation of mediocrity.

> But the customers "wanted" all the whizz-bang stuff.

I don't. I deliberately bought a car without any computers, not even EFi. I
put a computer in recently, an MP3 player. I'm sure something'll go wrong
with it.

ant

[ant]

Clockmeister wrote:
> The Japs only perfect what others have engineered and developed and
> choose the safe and boring options so reliability is much easier to
> achieve.

I'd rather be safely and boringly tootling along the Hume in my Suzuki
rather than standing on the side of it with a silent Merc!

ant

[Michael C]

"ant" <ant_kNOT@geocities.com> wrote in message
news:3efna3F2u292U1@individual.net...
> I'd rather be safely and boringly tootling along the Hume in my Suzuki
> rather than standing on the side of it with a silent Merc!

I'd take the merc.

Michael

[Fraser Johnston]

"rmcgrice" <mcgrice@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:Xns965443F4D2786nofuse@129.250.170.82...
> "jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:0ea9c9536c9b893fa55455dc5d3c566f@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com:
>
>> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>>
>>
>> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700
>
> I think it's hillarious :-)
> Most on this group knock Jaguar... LOL
>
> "Among individual nameplates, Lexus won - it does every year - followed by
> Cadillac and Jaguar, a big improver. Last place went to Hummer, followed
> by
> Volkswagen and Porsche. Volkswagen and Mercedes-Benz also rate well below
> average in JD Powers' annual Vehicle Dependability Study, which looks at
> problems in three-year-old cars."

Jaguar built by Ford = Good.
Jaguar built by British Leyland = Spawn of Satan.

Fraser

[SR71@NOSPAM@hotmail.com]

<Who failed to mention that it's same-same with computers for Lexus and

the other Toyota products, which eat the mercs for breakfast in the
reliability stakes:-)

AMEN:-]

Regards

G/B

[Kieron]

On Thu, 12 May 2005 07:30:07 +1000, "Dan---"
<nospa)m@203.61.241.14.com> wrote:

>"jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:0ea9c9536c9b893fa55455dc5d3c566f@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
>> I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>>
>>
>> http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700
>
>I also like German cars but I have been saying this for a few years German
>built cars are grossly over hyped. They use to build excellent cars and
>Mercedes Benz in the early 70's to late 90's were built like a tank. People
>rag on locally built cars because they have problems now the big G mobiles
>are not much better really.

Spot on Dan, and there hardly any shit in Bosch cars that arn't in
others to increase complexity neither.

[Uncle Bully]

"sheik yerbouti" <delbo21@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2rt381trudq1sodtd18tqv4467g65j2g71@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 11 May 2005 08:05:51 -0400, "jackbadger" <castle56@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>I DO love German cars, so this hurts
>>
>>http://www.drive.com.au/editorial/article.aspx?id=9700
>>
>>
> it's unfair. german cars have so many things packed into them, of
> course they're going to fail more regularly.
>

Um, if they don't work, you shouldn't be selling them.
Priorites for a vehicle are:
1. Work
2. Look cool