N13 Pulsar Power Steering

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to powering
steering?
Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?



Daryl

[Ext User(Toby Ponsenby)]

On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:

> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to powering
> steering?
> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>
>
>
> Daryl

The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll need
to look at a few systems to get it all figures.

Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
being;-)
--
Toby.
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur

[Ext User(Jason James)]

"D Walford" <walford@iprimus.com.au> wrote in message
news:4354d0fd$0$13323$61c65585@un-2park-reader-01.sydney.pipenetworks.com.au...
> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to powering
> steering?
> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>
>
>
> Daryl

My daughter's N13 has heavy steering too, even with 32 psi in the tires. I
can't imagine it being like this from new, so maybe the strut towers add
more castor (lean rearwards) has the upper mount wears? The lower
ball-joints are OK.

Jason

[Ext User(gazza)]

did hear to fit the power steering rack it was easier with the motor out not
much room to do anything with motor in just what I heard thats all folks

[Ext User(Ben Thomas)]

D Walford wrote:
> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to powering
> steering?
> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>
>
>
> Daryl
From memory that was all that was needed but the labor charge made it nearly a
$1000 upgrade when I investigated it about 3 years ago.

Might be cheaper and less painful if you sell it and buy one with PS. Definitely
worth it if you'll be upgrading to a Pulsar Q with the 1.8 MPEFI engine.

--
Ben Thomas - Melbourne, Australia
Opinions, conclusions, and other information in this message that do not
relate to the official business of my employer shall be understood as neither
given nor endorsed by it.

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Toby Ponsenby wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>
>
>>Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to powering
>>steering?
>>Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>
>>
>>
>>Daryl
>
>
> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll need
> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.

We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>
> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
> being;-)

Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the steering
is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at parking speeds.
New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.



Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Jason James wrote:
> "D Walford" <walford@iprimus.com.au> wrote in message
> news:4354d0fd$0$13323$61c65585@un-2park-reader-01.sydney.pipenetworks.com.au...
>
>>Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to powering
>>steering?
>>Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>
>>
>>
>>Daryl
>
>
> My daughter's N13 has heavy steering too, even with 32 psi in the tires. I
> can't imagine it being like this from new, so maybe the strut towers add
> more castor (lean rearwards) has the upper mount wears? The lower
> ball-joints are OK.
>

It seems typical of small fwd cars without power steering, I've driven a
Laser TX3 which was even heavier than the Pulsar.



Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

gazza wrote:
> did hear to fit the power steering rack it was easier with the motor out not
> much room to do anything with motor in just what I heard thats all folks
>
>
That's not what I want to hear, I want it to be a simple job or it won't
happen.



Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Ben Thomas wrote:
> D Walford wrote:
>
>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>> powering steering?
>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>
>>
>>
>> Daryl
>
> From memory that was all that was needed but the labor charge made it
> nearly a $1000 upgrade when I investigated it about 3 years ago.
>
> Might be cheaper and less painful if you sell it and buy one with PS.
> Definitely worth it if you'll be upgrading to a Pulsar Q with the 1.8
> MPEFI engine.

She (son's girlfriend) wants to buy a new car but all she needs is money:-)
She finishs her science degree at the end of the year so if she gets a
good job she can buy whatever she likes.
I don't see why it would cost $1000 to change a rack and fit a pump and
a few pipes.
I've converted an XF Falcon to ps and it was dead simple, it took about
4 hours and that wasn't rushing.



Daryl

[Ext User(atec)]

D Walford wrote:

> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>> powering steering?
>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Daryl
>>
>>
>>
>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll need
>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>
>
> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>
>>
>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>> being;-)
>
>
> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the steering
> is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at parking speeds.
> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.

I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very wrong or
she is kinda weak .

>
>
>
> Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

atec wrote:
> D Walford wrote:
>
>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>>> powering steering?
>>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Daryl
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll need
>>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>>
>>
>>
>> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>>
>>>
>>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>>> being;-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the steering
>> is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at parking speeds.
>> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>
>
> I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very wrong or
> she is kinda weak .

Did you miss the part where I said even I find the steering very heavy?
I've driven other non ps fwd cars that also have very heaving steering
so I doubt there is anything wrong with her car.


Daryl

[Ext User(atec)]

D Walford wrote:

> atec wrote:
>
>> D Walford wrote:
>>
>>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>>>> powering steering?
>>>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Daryl
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>>>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>>>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll need
>>>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>>>> being;-)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the
>>> steering is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at
>>> parking speeds.
>>> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>>
>>
>>
>> I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very wrong
>> or she is kinda weak .
>
>
> Did you miss the part where I said even I find the steering very heavy?
> I've driven other non ps fwd cars that also have very heaving steering
> so I doubt there is anything wrong with her car.
>
>
> Daryl

SIgh , lost your sence of reading humour . ok so it sounds like the
alighnment is shite , have you had it checked ?

[Ext User(D Walford)]

atec wrote:
> D Walford wrote:
>
>> atec wrote:
>>
>>> D Walford wrote:
>>>
>>>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>>>>> powering steering?
>>>>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Daryl
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>>>>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>>>>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll need
>>>>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>>>>> being;-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the
>>>> steering is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at
>>>> parking speeds.
>>>> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very wrong
>>> or she is kinda weak .
>>
>>
>>
>> Did you miss the part where I said even I find the steering very heavy?
>> I've driven other non ps fwd cars that also have very heaving steering
>> so I doubt there is anything wrong with her car.
>>
>>
>> Daryl
>
>
> SIgh , lost your sence of reading humour

Who me:-)

.. ok so it sounds like the
> alighnment is shite , have you had it checked ?

Not sure, may have been done when the new tyres were fitted about 6mths ago.



Daryl

[Ext User(atec)]

D Walford wrote:

> atec wrote:
>
>> D Walford wrote:
>>
>>> atec wrote:
>>>
>>>> D Walford wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>>>>>> powering steering?
>>>>>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Daryl
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>>>>>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>>>>>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll
>>>>>> need
>>>>>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>>>>>> being;-)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the
>>>>> steering is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at
>>>>> parking speeds.
>>>>> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very
>>>> wrong or she is kinda weak .
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Did you miss the part where I said even I find the steering very heavy?
>>> I've driven other non ps fwd cars that also have very heaving
>>> steering so I doubt there is anything wrong with her car.
>>>
>>>
>>> Daryl
>>
>>
>>
>> SIgh , lost your sence of reading humour
>
>
> Who me:-)
>
> . ok so it sounds like the
>
>> alighnment is shite , have you had it checked ?
>
>
> Not sure, may have been done when the new tyres were fitted about
> 6mths ago.
>
>
>
> Daryl
>
I know when racing Mini's the steering had heavy torque kick due to the
lsd diff but was light and easy. unless the alighnment was crap . has
the steering been getting worse ?

[Ext User(D Walford)]

atec wrote:
> D Walford wrote:
>
>> atec wrote:
>>
>>> D Walford wrote:
>>>
>>>> atec wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> D Walford wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>>>>>>> powering steering?
>>>>>>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Daryl
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>>>>>>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>>>>>>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll
>>>>>>> need
>>>>>>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>>>>>>> being;-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the
>>>>>> steering is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at
>>>>>> parking speeds.
>>>>>> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very
>>>>> wrong or she is kinda weak .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Did you miss the part where I said even I find the steering very heavy?
>>>> I've driven other non ps fwd cars that also have very heaving
>>>> steering so I doubt there is anything wrong with her car.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Daryl
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> SIgh , lost your sence of reading humour
>>
>>
>>
>> Who me:-)
>>
>> . ok so it sounds like the
>>
>>> alighnment is shite , have you had it checked ?
>>
>>
>>
>> Not sure, may have been done when the new tyres were fitted about
>> 6mths ago.
>>
>>
>>
>> Daryl
>>
> I know when racing Mini's the steering had heavy torque kick due to the
> lsd diff but was light and easy. unless the alighnment was crap . has
> the steering been getting worse ?

AFAIK its always been heavy.



Daryl

[Ext User(budgie)]

On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 14:43:06 +1000, D Walford <walford@iprimus.com.au> wrote:

(snip)

>Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the steering
>is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at parking speeds.
>New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.

The strut towers on the Astra equivalent of the N13 had a habit of getting
"friendly", and a brace was usually fitted if you liked punting them. I'd
certainly have the geometry checked before even contemplating a PS retrofit.

[Ext User(D Walford)]

budgie wrote:
> On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 14:43:06 +1000, D Walford <walford@iprimus.com.au> wrote:
>
> (snip)
>
>
>>Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the steering
>>is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at parking speeds.
>>New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>
>
> The strut towers on the Astra equivalent of the N13 had a habit of getting
> "friendly", and a brace was usually fitted if you liked punting them. I'd
> certainly have the geometry checked before even contemplating a PS retrofit.

Thanks, sounds like the alignment needs checking by someone who knows
what they are doing.


Daryl

[Ext User(Toby Ponsenby)]

On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 20:27:16 +1000, D Walford wrote:

> atec wrote:
>> D Walford wrote:
>>
>>> atec wrote:
>>>
>>>> D Walford wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> atec wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> D Walford wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:39:53 +1000, D Walford wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>>>>>>>> powering steering?
>>>>>>>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Daryl
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The 'idle-up' circuit would be a tad tricky. It's a gem, and better
>>>>>>>> than Toyota and the German ones, IMHO.
>>>>>>>> Defo need a manual for the car to investigate the matter - you'll
>>>>>>>> need
>>>>>>>> to look at a few systems to get it all figures.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We bought a manual last weekend when we replaced the timing belt.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Better to run higher tyre pressures on skinny tyres for the time
>>>>>>>> being;-)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Its my son's girlfriends car and even with high pressures the
>>>>>>> steering is still too heavy for her, even I find it too heavy at
>>>>>>> parking speeds.
>>>>>>> New tyres a couple of months ago helped but it needs ps.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I suggest you send her to gym , either there is something very
>>>>>> wrong or she is kinda weak .
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Did you miss the part where I said even I find the steering very heavy?
>>>>> I've driven other non ps fwd cars that also have very heaving
>>>>> steering so I doubt there is anything wrong with her car.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Daryl
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> SIgh , lost your sence of reading humour
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Who me:-)
>>>
>>> . ok so it sounds like the
>>>
>>>> alighnment is shite , have you had it checked ?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Not sure, may have been done when the new tyres were fitted about
>>> 6mths ago.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Daryl
>>>
>> I know when racing Mini's the steering had heavy torque kick due to the
>> lsd diff but was light and easy. unless the alighnment was crap . has
>> the steering been getting worse ?
>
> AFAIK its always been heavy.
>
>
>
> Daryl

IIRC, the bearings on the top of the struts on those things are nylon
bushes. That means they might be buggered and causing the problem with
the steering.
Easy enough to check that if there's a spring compressor and an hour
or two handy. And some decent HP grease in the system might at least
point you in the right direction for a fix of the problem.
I know the Nissans bigger than the Pulsar get needle rollers in the
strut bearings, and I figure the Pulsars are right on the edge of
needing real bearings like that.
Then there's the ball-joints - but they'd have to be really rooted to
effect steering effort in a major way.

--
Toby.
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur

[Ext User(Ben Thomas)]

D Walford wrote:

> Ben Thomas wrote:
>
>> D Walford wrote:
>>
>>> Anyone know if its possible to upgrade a manual steering N13 to
>>> powering steering?
>>> Would it be as simple as bolting on the pump, plumbing and ps rack?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Daryl
>>
>>
>> From memory that was all that was needed but the labor charge made it
>> nearly a $1000 upgrade when I investigated it about 3 years ago.
>>
>> Might be cheaper and less painful if you sell it and buy one with PS.
>> Definitely worth it if you'll be upgrading to a Pulsar Q with the 1.8
>> MPEFI engine.
>
>
> She (son's girlfriend) wants to buy a new car but all she needs is money:-)
> She finishs her science degree at the end of the year so if she gets a
> good job she can buy whatever she likes.
> I don't see why it would cost $1000 to change a rack and fit a pump and
> a few pipes.
> I've converted an XF Falcon to ps and it was dead simple, it took about
> 4 hours and that wasn't rushing.

Perhaps the parts prices were retail, not trade, and then the mechanic may have
been overestimating the time to do it because he didn't really want to and just
wanted to put me off.

Anyway, I had 15x6 rims on my N13 and I got sore abs if I drove it for several
hours after driving a power steer car for several weeks. So I guess it had
pretty heavy steering, but it never really bothered me - the heavier steering
was worth it for better braking in the wet than I used to get on the regular
skinny tyres on a dry road.

--
Ben Thomas - Melbourne, Australia
Opinions, conclusions, and other information in this message that do not
relate to the official business of my employer shall be understood as neither
given nor endorsed by it.

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Toby Ponsenby wrote:

> IIRC, the bearings on the top of the struts on those things are nylon
> bushes. That means they might be buggered and causing the problem with
> the steering.
> Easy enough to check that if there's a spring compressor and an hour
> or two handy. And some decent HP grease in the system might at least
> point you in the right direction for a fix of the problem.
> I know the Nissans bigger than the Pulsar get needle rollers in the
> strut bearings, and I figure the Pulsars are right on the edge of
> needing real bearings like that.
> Then there's the ball-joints - but they'd have to be really rooted to
> effect steering effort in a major way.
>

It shoudn't be too difficult to check those parts, if the front of the
car is lifted off the ground and the steering is still heavy then I will
need investigate further.



Daryl