Indicator Levers

[Ext User(Toby Ponsenby)]

On 22 Mar 2006 04:33:35 -0800, o0.rapture.0o@gmail.com wrote:

> Hey guys, I've looked around but had a bit of trouble finding any
> information about this.
>
> I've been looking around at a Holden Vectra or Astra, and noticed that
> they have the indicator lever on the left rather than the right (on the
> right is normal in Aus/Japan, but left everywhere else in the world, or
> so i believe).
>
> Being used to it on the right, I'd naturally prefer it there but I was
> wondering if anyone else has "converted" to using the left-hand lever
> and if so, how long it took? Has anyone ever not bought a car because
> of this?
>
> Failing my ability to "convert" to the left-hand lever.. Does anyone
> know if I would I have any hope of "converting" the car to the right?
> :P
>
> Brad

Hah, I almost forgot;-)
You'll get the usual who say they can re-program their reflex-arc
(that's what it is with experienced drivers) to operate either way
depending on vehicle with nary a problem, even under duress.

It'll be bullshit.
Only inexperienced drivers could possibly make that claim.

Especially when it's considered that it's under duress that the
reflex-arc is most useful and called upon - and it's then that the
problem, if it is to become one, occurs.
Of course those drivers might be inconsiderate enough to blank out the
requirement to indicate when they're under duress.

Also considering that the OP is a troll to allow Clocky (only one so
far, too) to have a crow about GM actually managing to do something
about the problem. That also admits/indicates:-) that it IS a problem.
Which is a first for a manufacturer of any colour.

--
Toby.
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur

[Ext User(Clockmeister)]

"Toby Ponsenby" <toby@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:166iet67zssog$.1ka04ndikmivt.dlg@40tude.net.. .
> On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 22:30:47 +0800, Clockmeister wrote:
>
>> "Patrick Young" <patrick@hilux.ace.unsw.EDU.AU> wrote in message
>> news:I4dUf.13931$dy4.13147@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>>> Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>
>>>> Expect ridicule.
>>>> Good subject to play with, though.
>>>> Expect the Erro car owners to 'support' their chariots, and the Jap
>>>> and Aus owners to support theirs.
>>>>
>>>> You 'can' convert to the lever system really no matter what is there.
>>>> Donor car, wreckers, nightmares with turtle shells and wiring and all.
>>>> Time, money and aggravations is all it takes.
>>>> But my argument on the matter is why the fuck should we in .aus have
>>>> to?
>>>
>>> Good point.
>>
>> He has no point. If you don't like it you are welcome to buy another car.
>
> Buy a complete car because manufacturers won't option in a few bits
> and pieces for the sake of safety on the one that otherwise conforms
> to your requirements ?
> It's not like the bits are an engine or anything.
>
> Fuck you have an immense intellect, Clocky.

You are a terminal whiner Toby, on Astra and Vectra conversion kits were
always available but no-one bothered with them since having the indicator on
the other side just isn't an issue.

[Ext User(Clockmeister)]

"Toby Ponsenby" <toby@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:114xciqnom84b.1vbmqadz6rhg2$.dlg@40tude.net.. .
> On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 22:05:17 +0800, Clockmeister wrote:
>
>> <o0.rapture.0o@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:1143030815.457549.300900@u72g2000cwu.googlegr oups.com...
>>> Hey guys, I've looked around but had a bit of trouble finding any
>>> information about this.
>>>
>>> I've been looking around at a Holden Vectra or Astra, and noticed that
>>> they have the indicator lever on the left rather than the right (on the
>>> right is normal in Aus/Japan, but left everywhere else in the world, or
>>> so i believe).
>>
>> The new models are come as right side as default. They can be changed by
>> poking in a new stick and reprogramming the CIM configuration.
>>
>>> Being used to it on the right, I'd naturally prefer it there but I was
>>> wondering if anyone else has "converted" to using the left-hand lever
>>> and if so, how long it took?
>>
>> My other half took about a day to convert. Because I drive cars with
>> right
>> and left mounted indicator stalks all the time I switch over
>> subconsciously
>> without thinking about it depending on what I am driving.
>>
>> Has anyone ever not bought a car because
>>> of this?
>>
>> It's rediculous to not buy a car for such a reason.
>>
>>> Failing my ability to "convert" to the left-hand lever.. Does anyone
>>> know if I would I have any hope of "converting" the car to the right?
>>
>> Genuine changeover kits are available from your Holden dealer for older
>> model Astra's and Vectra's.
>
> Some light at the end of the tunnel.
> So which GovCo insisted GM provide the options?

Who cares if they even did or not, I don't know anyone who bothered with the
option.

> Did you get to figure that out?
>

Since the cars complied with ADR I doubt the government had anything to do
with it. I suspect GM made the option available for terminal whiners like
yourself.

[Ext User(Clockmeister)]

"Toby Ponsenby" <toby@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:imuiinrvyqud$.17ug6ki35trs4.dlg@40tude.net...
> On 22 Mar 2006 04:33:35 -0800, o0.rapture.0o@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Hey guys, I've looked around but had a bit of trouble finding any
>> information about this.
>>
>> I've been looking around at a Holden Vectra or Astra, and noticed that
>> they have the indicator lever on the left rather than the right (on the
>> right is normal in Aus/Japan, but left everywhere else in the world, or
>> so i believe).
>>
>> Being used to it on the right, I'd naturally prefer it there but I was
>> wondering if anyone else has "converted" to using the left-hand lever
>> and if so, how long it took? Has anyone ever not bought a car because
>> of this?
>>
>> Failing my ability to "convert" to the left-hand lever.. Does anyone
>> know if I would I have any hope of "converting" the car to the right?
>> :P
>>
>> Brad
>
> Hah, I almost forgot;-)
> You'll get the usual who say they can re-program their reflex-arc
> (that's what it is with experienced drivers) to operate either way
> depending on vehicle with nary a problem, even under duress.
>
> It'll be bullshit.
> Only inexperienced drivers could possibly make that claim.
>
> Especially when it's considered that it's under duress that the
> reflex-arc is most useful and called upon - and it's then that the
> problem, if it is to become one, occurs.
> Of course those drivers might be inconsiderate enough to blank out the
> requirement to indicate when they're under duress.
>
> Also considering that the OP is a troll to allow Clocky (only one so
> far, too) to have a crow about GM actually managing to do something
> about the problem. That also admits/indicates:-) that it IS a problem.
> Which is a first for a manufacturer of any colour.


Put your foil hat on, and have a lie down.

[Ext User(Clockmeister)]

"Ben Thomas" <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote in message
news:spm8f3-917.ln1@teri.unico.com.au...
> Michael C wrote:
>> "ShazWozza" <shaz_wozza@elementspring.com> wrote in message
>>
>>>It takes just a few drives to retrain your brain to work with left handed
>>>indicators and it will become second nature. Its not a problem. Being
>>>left
>>>handed I prefer the left handed setup (esp for operating the high beam
>>>switch).
>>
>>
>> It wouldn't be much good if had a manual trans tho.
>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> It's excellent because it forces you to indicate early (as you are
> supposed to do) then change gears before a corner. If you are indicating
> as you turn the wheel then you are a cunt.

It's also safer to have it on the left since most people are right handed
they will always have their strongest hand on the wheel.

<Toby mode on>

It's a GovCo conspiracy to cause more accidents that most stalks ended up on
the right hand side in the first place. More accidents can then be blamed on
speeding and an increase in revenue raising with speed measuring devices can
then be justified.

<Toby mode off>

[Ext User(Dan---)]

"Clockmeister" <no-one@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:1222mbh6bb0pbf7@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Michael C" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:442153dd$0$7600$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au ...
>> "ShazWozza" <shaz_wozza@elementspring.com> wrote in message
>>>> It wouldn't be much good if had a manual trans tho.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>> Actually mine is a manual. No problems at all.
>>
>> IMO it would be a pita. I keep my left hand near the gearlever and my
>> right on the wheel near the lever so that I don't have to move either
>> much.
>>
>
> Pita? Don't be rediculous.

A friend of mine bought herself an Astra and I asked how long it took her to
get use to the indicator stalk location. She said it only took her about 10
minutes to get use to.
She has no problems with it at all now.


--
Regards
Dan

[Ext User(Dan---)]

"Kev" <kevcat@optunet.com.au> wrote in message
news:44219d8f$0$7528$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au ...

>
> every truck on the road not made in Japan has it on the left
> and it's never a problem even when changing gears(a lot more than in a
> car)
>
>
Every time I get into the drivers seat in a truck first thing I look at is
the indicator stalk,
Then the engine brake switch next.

--
Regards
Dan

[Ext User(D Walford)]

o0.rapture.0o@gmail.com wrote:
> Hey guys, I've looked around but had a bit of trouble finding any
> information about this.
>
> I've been looking around at a Holden Vectra or Astra, and noticed that
> they have the indicator lever on the left rather than the right (on the
> right is normal in Aus/Japan, but left everywhere else in the world, or
> so i believe).
>
> Being used to it on the right, I'd naturally prefer it there but I was
> wondering if anyone else has "converted" to using the left-hand lever
> and if so, how long it took? Has anyone ever not bought a car because
> of this?
>
> Failing my ability to "convert" to the left-hand lever.. Does anyone
> know if I would I have any hope of "converting" the car to the right?
> :P
>
You will get used to it very quickly, the truck I drive like many trucks
has its indicator switch on the left but my car has it on the right.
I occasionally stuff up when first getting in the car to go home from
work but it usually only happens once.



Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Michael C wrote:
> "ShazWozza" <shaz_wozza@elementspring.com> wrote in message
>
>>It takes just a few drives to retrain your brain to work with left handed
>>indicators and it will become second nature. Its not a problem. Being left
>>handed I prefer the left handed setup (esp for operating the high beam
>>switch).
>
>
> It wouldn't be much good if had a manual trans tho.

I've got a 16spd manual and the indicator switch on the left, I've never
found it to be been a problem.


Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Toby Ponsenby wrote:
> On 22 Mar 2006 04:33:35 -0800, o0.rapture.0o@gmail.com wrote:
>
>
>>Hey guys, I've looked around but had a bit of trouble finding any
>>information about this.
>>
>>I've been looking around at a Holden Vectra or Astra, and noticed that
>>they have the indicator lever on the left rather than the right (on the
>>right is normal in Aus/Japan, but left everywhere else in the world, or
>>so i believe).
>>
>>Being used to it on the right, I'd naturally prefer it there but I was
>>wondering if anyone else has "converted" to using the left-hand lever
>>and if so, how long it took? Has anyone ever not bought a car because
>>of this?
>>
>>Failing my ability to "convert" to the left-hand lever.. Does anyone
>>know if I would I have any hope of "converting" the car to the right?
>>:P
>>
>>Brad
>
>
> Hmmm.
>
> Expect ridicule.
> Good subject to play with, though.
> Expect the Erro car owners to 'support' their chariots, and the Jap
> and Aus owners to support theirs.

I regularly drive vehicles with either location and never find it to be
a problem.
I used to think it would be a problem but in reality it never has been.
Its interesting that most trucks, including the American ones have the
indicator switches on the left, the Jap trucks seem to be the only ones
with the switch on the right.



Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Toby Ponsenby wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 22:30:47 +0800, Clockmeister wrote:
>
>
>>"Patrick Young" <patrick@hilux.ace.unsw.EDU.AU> wrote in message
>>news:I4dUf.13931$dy4.13147@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>>
>>>Toby Ponsenby wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Expect ridicule.
>>>>Good subject to play with, though.
>>>>Expect the Erro car owners to 'support' their chariots, and the Jap
>>>>and Aus owners to support theirs.
>>>>
>>>>You 'can' convert to the lever system really no matter what is there.
>>>>Donor car, wreckers, nightmares with turtle shells and wiring and all.
>>>>Time, money and aggravations is all it takes.
>>>>But my argument on the matter is why the fuck should we in .aus have
>>>>to?
>>>
>>>Good point.
>>
>>He has no point. If you don't like it you are welcome to buy another car.
>
>
> Buy a complete car because manufacturers won't option in a few bits
> and pieces for the sake of safety on the one that otherwise conforms
> to your requirements ?
> It's not like the bits are an engine or anything.
>
> Fuck you have an immense intellect, Clocky.

In the past I would have agreed with you but having driven many vehicles
with switches on either side I now agree with Clocky:-)



Daryl

[Ext User(D Walford)]

Kev wrote:
> Michael C wrote:
>
>> "ShazWozza" <shaz_wozza@elementspring.com> wrote in message
>>
>>> It takes just a few drives to retrain your brain to work with left
>>> handed
>>> indicators and it will become second nature. Its not a problem. Being
>>> left
>>> handed I prefer the left handed setup (esp for operating the high beam
>>> switch).
>>
>>
>>
>> It wouldn't be much good if had a manual trans tho.
>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> every truck on the road not made in Japan has it on the left
> and it's never a problem even when changing gears(a lot more than in a car)
>
> it's just something you get used to
> and just to see how good you are
> try driving a truck all day then get into your Aussie car and drive it home
>
> sometimes when I'm a bit tired I indicate with the wipers
> :)

Yep, I clean my windscreen almost every time I get in the Hilux after
driving the DAF:-)



Daryl

[Ext User(Michael C)]

"Clockmeister" <no-one@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:1222mbh6bb0pbf7@corp.supernews.com...
> Pita? Don't be rediculous.

Pita is possibly too strong but I would definately say it's less convenient.

Michael

[Ext User(Bernd Felsche)]

D Walford <walford@iprimus.com.au> writes:
>Kev wrote:
>> Michael C wrote:
>>> "ShazWozza" <shaz_wozza@elementspring.com> wrote in message

>>>> It takes just a few drives to retrain your brain to work with
>>>> left handed indicators and it will become second nature. Its
>>>> not a problem. Being left handed I prefer the left handed setup
>>>> (esp for operating the high beam switch).

>>> It wouldn't be much good if had a manual trans tho.

>> every truck on the road not made in Japan has it on the left and
>> it's never a problem even when changing gears(a lot more than in
>> a car)

>> it's just something you get used to and just to see how good you
>> are try driving a truck all day then get into your Aussie car and
>> drive it home

>> sometimes when I'm a bit tired I indicate with the wipers
>> :)

>Yep, I clean my windscreen almost every time I get in the Hilux
>after driving the DAF:-)

Not such a bad thing to have a clean windscreen.

A permanent fix to the "problem" would be for you to trade the Hilux
in on an SWB LT, T5 or Caddy. :-)
--
/"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
\ / ASCII ribbon campaign | "Laws do not persuade just because
X against HTML mail | they threaten."
/ \ and postings | Lucius Annaeus Seneca, c. 4BC - 65AD.

[Ext User(Bernd Felsche)]

Ben Thomas <nosp@m.thanks.mate> writes:

>Michael C wrote:
>> "ShazWozza" <shaz_wozza@elementspring.com> wrote in message

>>>It takes just a few drives to retrain your brain to work with

Ermm... one wipe of the windscreen. aka Friendly wave to oncoming
traffic :-)

>>>left handed indicators and it will become second nature. Its not
>>>a problem. Being left handed I prefer the left handed setup (esp
>>>for operating the high beam switch).

>> It wouldn't be much good if had a manual trans tho.

>It's excellent because it forces you to indicate early (as you are
>supposed to do) then change gears before a corner. If you are
>indicating as you turn the wheel then you are a cunt.

Defensive driving
1. Mirror(s)
2. Signal
3. (Brakes)
4. (Gears)
5. Mirror(s)
6. Action

Cunt driving required only steps 2, 3 and 6.
--
/"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
\ / ASCII ribbon campaign | "Laws do not persuade just because
X against HTML mail | they threaten."
/ \ and postings | Lucius Annaeus Seneca, c. 4BC - 65AD.

[Ext User(budgie)]

On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 04:55:11 +1000, Kev <kevcat@optunet.com.au> wrote:

>every truck on the road not made in Japan has it on the left
>and it's never a problem even when changing gears(a lot more than in a car)
>
>it's just something you get used to
>and just to see how good you are
>try driving a truck all day then get into your Aussie car and drive it home
>
>sometimes when I'm a bit tired I indicate with the wipers
>:)

Agree. The first new car I had was a Fart 125 back in '70. Left indicators,
right wiper arm. Took a short while for it to become a reflex, and also had the
occasional lapse and indicated with a wiper wave. But it's no drama in a manual
trans vehicle unless you are an especially challenged blonde.

[Ext User(budgie)]

On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 20:05:02 GMT, Ben Thomas <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote:

>It's excellent because it forces you to indicate early (as you are
>supposed to do) then change gears before a corner. If you are indicating
>as you turn the wheel then you are a cunt.

Elegantly put.

Now to get govcowa's stoopid how_to_signal_at_a_roundabout rules sorted, and we
will all be happy.

[Ext User(budgie)]

On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 22:17:05 GMT, Toby Ponsenby <toby@privacy.net> wrote:

>Also considering that the OP is a troll to allow Clocky (only one so
>far, too) to have a crow about GM actually managing to do something
>about the problem. That also admits/indicates:-) that it IS a problem.
>Which is a first for a manufacturer of any colour.

It's actually a clever marketing ploy by the manufacturers. This way they sell
you TWO switch assemblies.

[Ext User(tlai909@visto.com)]

I have to ask why British cars have the indicators on the left as a
default?

On automatic cars it's largely irrelevant I must admit.

However on manual cars, it will upset the pedantic or OCD types like
Toby.

I have a strong sense of the 'way things should be' so I agree with
Toby (if only with a bit less spittle).

If the Japanese can get RHD cars on the right and LHD cars on the left,
why can't anyone else?

I would suspect the Japanese are just slightly more focussed on the
details than everyone else.

Even the usually reliable Germans have dropped the ball.

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"Michael C" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:4421e202$0$20113$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...

> Pita is possibly too strong but I would definately say it's less
> convenient.

I don't find it any more or less convenient than having the radio volume
knob on the wrong side.

--
Regards,
Noddy.