HDMI It's all changed again :-(

[Ext User(TT)]

I've just finished reading this re: HDMI 1.3 spec just
released

http://www.avrev.com/news/0706/06.hdmi13.shtml

And to top it off the plug size has just been changed as
well!!!!

So as far as I'm concerned HDMI/BluRay/HD-DVD can all go and
take a flying leap for the next couple of years. I have
always been an early adopter of all sorts of new gear but
this fiasco now has got a lot of sorting out to do before I
will go anywhere near it.

Just to show how really pissed I am at a lot of this gear
(SACD/DVD-A as well) I am actually buying more new Vinyl LPs
than DVD-Vs at the moment. I think it's called going retro
;-)

Cheers TT

[Ext User(Jeßus)]

On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, TT proclaimed:

> I've just finished reading this re: HDMI 1.3 spec just
> released
> http://www.avrev.com/news/0706/06.hdmi13.shtml
> And to top it off the plug size has just been changed as
> well!!!!
> So as far as I'm concerned HDMI/BluRay/HD-DVD can all go and
> take a flying leap for the next couple of years. I have
> always been an early adopter of all sorts of new gear but
> this fiasco now has got a lot of sorting out to do before I
> will go anywhere near it.

Bloody oath...
This next generation stuff appears to be a complete mess,
irrespective of whether you're a consumer or manufacturer.

I'm steering well clear of this crap until the dust has well and
truly settled and BluRay/HDDVD titles are sitting on the shelves at Kmart.
*Then* I'll look into it. Always been an early adopter - but not this time!

> Just to show how really pissed I am at a lot of this gear (SACD/DVD-A as
> well) I am actually buying more new Vinyl LPs than DVD-Vs at the moment.
> I think it's called going retro ;-)

Same. My vinyl collection has exploded this year, also gone back to Reel
to Reel and even hooked up the Nakamichi cassette deck again :)

Speaking of DVD-A...
I have Fleetwood Mac's Rumours on DVD-A here, my DVD player's audio
connects via optical to my amp... however the audio is not reaching the
ultimate destination: the speakers.

Can somebody please confirm that DVD-A audio will use an optical output,
please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look through the Pioneer
767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
I haven't had time to investigate this further, but figured I may as well
ask here whilst I'm at it :)

Cheers,
--
/J/
Cut the crap to email me...
Webcam: http://homepages.picknowl.com.au/glen1070/x.jpg

[Ext User(JE)]

"Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
news:pan.2006.07.08.01.23.57.13384@anunnakis@area5 1.org...
> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, TT proclaimed:
>
> Can somebody please confirm that DVD-A audio will use an optical output,

Nope!

> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look through the Pioneer
> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.

6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!

[Ext User(Jeßus)]

On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 09:28:53 +0800, JE proclaimed:

> "Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
> news:pan.2006.07.08.01.23.57.13384@anunnakis@area5 1.org...
>> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, TT proclaimed:
>> Can somebody please confirm that DVD-A audio will use an optical output,
>
> Nope!
>
>> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look through the Pioneer
>> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
>
> 6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!

Goddammit, that's not what I wanted to hear, LOL :)

I think I'm at my breaking point when it comes to adding yet more cables
to my system, sigh. I have SACD as well, and am aware they require the
RCA connection, however I was hoping DVD-A would be different... so this
means an analogue signal to the amp, right? If so... what's the bloody
point of DVD-A?

Cheers,

--
/J/
Cut the crap to email me...
Webcam: http://homepages.picknowl.com.au/glen1070/x.jpg

[Ext User(JE)]

"Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
news:pan.2006.07.08.02.30.27.557044@anunnakis@area 51.org...
> If so... what's the bloody
> point of DVD-A?

There isn't any point, thats why DVD-A has been such a sucess :-)

[Ext User(Italo)]

"Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
news:pan.2006.07.08.02.30.27.557044@anunnakis@area 51.org...
> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 09:28:53 +0800, JE proclaimed:
>
>> "Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
>> news:pan.2006.07.08.01.23.57.13384@anunnakis@area5 1.org...
>>> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, TT proclaimed:
>>> Can somebody please confirm that DVD-A audio will use an optical output,
>>
>> Nope!
>>
>>> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look through the Pioneer
>>> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
>>
>> 6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!
>
> Goddammit, that's not what I wanted to hear, LOL :)

DVD-A will be delivered through the HDMI digital connection... so long as
you have an HDMI input on your amplifier.
--
Italo

[Ext User(TT)]

"Italo" <inottetolati@xmg.ten> wrote in message
news:44af294c$0$21440$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...

> >>> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look
through the Pioneer
> >>> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
> >>
> >> 6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!

Or SACD multi- channel. You can still get the hi-res as
stereo in both with just two RCAs.

> >
> > Goddammit, that's not what I wanted to hear, LOL :)

This whole next couple of years will be like that - believe
me. Wait till someone tells you $10,000, 1 year old, HD
display with an HDMI input is useless and you have to throw
it away *IF* you want HD from an optical disc. It will make
6 more cables look cheap :-)

>
> DVD-A will be delivered through the HDMI digital
connection... so long as
> you have an HDMI input on your amplifier.
> --
> Italo
>
........................ and the amplifier has the necessary
authorised software and will talk to the DVD-A player that
also has the authorised software to allow digital out to
start with. It will only take *one* noncompliant link and
the whole thing will be down sampled.

This whole fiasco **SUCKS**.

Cheers TT

[Ext User(Alan Rutlidge)]

"TT" <TTencerNOSPAM@westnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:44af44ee$1@quokka.wn.com.au...
>
> "Italo" <inottetolati@xmg.ten> wrote in message
> news:44af294c$0$21440$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.a u...
>
>> >>> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look
> through the Pioneer
>> >>> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
>> >>
>> >> 6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!
>
> Or SACD multi- channel. You can still get the hi-res as
> stereo in both with just two RCAs.
>
>> >
>> > Goddammit, that's not what I wanted to hear, LOL :)
>
> This whole next couple of years will be like that - believe
> me. Wait till someone tells you $10,000, 1 year old, HD
> display with an HDMI input is useless and you have to throw
> it away *IF* you want HD from an optical disc. It will make
> 6 more cables look cheap :-)
>
>>
>> DVD-A will be delivered through the HDMI digital
> connection... so long as
>> you have an HDMI input on your amplifier.
>> --
>> Italo
>>
> ....................... and the amplifier has the necessary
> authorised software and will talk to the DVD-A player that
> also has the authorised software to allow digital out to
> start with. It will only take *one* noncompliant link and
> the whole thing will be down sampled.
>
> This whole fiasco **SUCKS**.
>
> Cheers TT
>
>

There is a term for all of this. It's called "obsolescence". Manufacturers
would be out of business if everyone made the same standard and never
changed it. As much as I hate this sort of thing I deal with it by only
making changes only when there are significant leaps in technology. (famous
last words :P)

Hmmmm.... let's look at some of the stable -

1st gen DVD-A player - Pioneer
2nd gen SACD/CD player - Sony
Digital Compact Cassette (2nd gen) - Philips
MD (ATRAC 3.5) - Sony
Analogue cassette (Dolby C HX-Pro) - Sony
2 track reel to reel - Tascam
S-VHS (1st gen) was there ever a later? (JVC)
LaserDisc (must be one of the last - has AC-3 RF) - Pioneer
Technics DD turntable SL1200 (1st gen) recently displaced but not replaced
by a Technics SL1200GLD
dbx 119 (now that's seriously old)

As much as we detest the changes manufacturers impose on Joe Public, we are
our own worst enemies. Why? Because we stupidly (moi included) buy their
products. And most of us did in good faith they weren't going to be come
white elephants overnight. Try buying a pre-recorded or bank DCC tape now.
R-R is getting scarce as well. :-(

Nothing stays the same forever. However I appreciate TT's point on the
potential limited compatibility of a 1 y.o. HD display.

Cheers,
Alan

[Ext User(Rick Stadelmaier)]

JE wrote:
> "Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
> news:pan.2006.07.08.01.23.57.13384@anunnakis@area5 1.org...
>> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, TT proclaimed:
>>
>> Can somebody please confirm that DVD-A audio will use an optical output,
>
> Nope!
>
>> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look through the Pioneer
>> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
>
> 6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!


Not so, DVD-A can also be used with just 2 channels, it also sounds better that
way, IMO.

Rick.

--
Rick Stadelmaier
Equinox Audio
http://www.equinoxaudio.com.au
rick@SPAMTRAPequinoxaudio.com.au
(remove SPAMTRAP to reply via email)
Sydney, Australia

[Ext User(Alan Rutlidge)]

"Rick Stadelmaier" <rick@SPAMTRAPequinoxaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:1152344513.412338@news.pip.com.au...
> JE wrote:
>> "Jeßus" <127.0.0.1@wilddslcrap.net.au> wrote in message
>> news:pan.2006.07.08.01.23.57.13384@anunnakis@area5 1.org...
>>> On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, TT proclaimed:
>>>
>>> Can somebody please confirm that DVD-A audio will use an optical output,
>>
>> Nope!
>>
>>> please don't tell me it needs analogue! A quick look through the Pioneer
>>> 767A's settings, it appears to be all okay.
>>
>> 6 RCA plugs is the only way to hear DVD-A!
>
>
> Not so, DVD-A can also be used with just 2 channels, it also sounds better
> that way, IMO.
>
> Rick.
>
> --
> Rick Stadelmaier
> Equinox Audio
> http://www.equinoxaudio.com.au
> rick@SPAMTRAPequinoxaudio.com.au
> (remove SPAMTRAP to reply via email)
> Sydney, Australia

Agreed Rick. The problem is some DVD-A discs don't come with a stereo
advanced resolution soundtrack and this means you need to put your DVD-A
player in to 2 channel mode, relying on the downmix facility and the
authoring of the disc to convert from 6 channels to 2. On some discs this
mixdown authoring is quite good, whilst on others it leaves a bit to be
desired. Just a pity not ALL DVD-A discs come with a dedicated 2 channel
advanced resolution track.

Cheers,
Alan

[Ext User(SalesMart.com.au)]

On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, "TT" <TTencerNOSPAM@westnet.com.au>
wrote:

>I've just finished reading this re: HDMI 1.3 spec just
>released
>
>http://www.avrev.com/news/0706/06.hdmi13.shtml
>
>And to top it off the plug size has just been changed as
>well!!!!
>
>So as far as I'm concerned HDMI/BluRay/HD-DVD can all go and
>take a flying leap for the next couple of years. I have
>always been an early adopter of all sorts of new gear but
>this fiasco now has got a lot of sorting out to do before I
>will go anywhere near it.
>
>Just to show how really pissed I am at a lot of this gear
>(SACD/DVD-A as well) I am actually buying more new Vinyl LPs
>than DVD-Vs at the moment. I think it's called going retro
>;-)
>
>Cheers TT

A couple of years ago I was very excited at Blu-Ray.
Now its one big mess.

The next format in HVD looked like they may have been going somewhere
but they too are looking at copy protection which means they'll end up
in the same mess as HD-DVD and Blu-Ray.

Nano is the next one after HVD but they'll go and mess things up as
well. No one leans from there mistakes these days.

Stick with DVD. Its going to take years before these companies come to
their senses with high capacity media/drives/players.

Up convert or up scaling of DVD is where its all going now.
Many DVD players with up scaling to near HD capacity.
But if they keep on altering the plugs then there are going to be
problems.

If buying a TV set I'd make very sure it has at least two HDMI
connections.

Maybe someone will invent a converting cable to go from the old to the
new. Who knows there maybe a cable that does that now.

Anyway SED TV Sets are on the way. Shall be interesting to see if they
still with the older HDMI or go with the new.

SalesMart.com.au
Perth, Western Australia
http://www.salesmart.com.au
*******************************************
Email Contact info on the above site.
*******************************************

[Ext User(Falco)]

Colin; SED is looking VERY shaky at the moment.
Toshiba & Canon are making noises that; "due to the hastened collapse of LCD
prices; SED tv sets may not be able to be sold at a profit".

They are already a year behind schedule with the release of SED and are now
saying SED wont be released till fourth quarter 2007, and may not be ready
till 1st quarter 2008.

I don't think they will make it into production (unfortunately)




"SalesMart.com.au" <sales@___Email_Address_on_Web_site> wrote in message
news:44af8a5a.752843@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> On Sat, 8 Jul 2006 08:34:01 +0800, "TT" <TTencerNOSPAM@westnet.com.au>
> wrote:
>
>>I've just finished reading this re: HDMI 1.3 spec just
>>released
>>
>>http://www.avrev.com/news/0706/06.hdmi13.shtml
>>
>>And to top it off the plug size has just been changed as
>>well!!!!
>>
>>So as far as I'm concerned HDMI/BluRay/HD-DVD can all go and
>>take a flying leap for the next couple of years. I have
>>always been an early adopter of all sorts of new gear but
>>this fiasco now has got a lot of sorting out to do before I
>>will go anywhere near it.
>>
>>Just to show how really pissed I am at a lot of this gear
>>(SACD/DVD-A as well) I am actually buying more new Vinyl LPs
>>than DVD-Vs at the moment. I think it's called going retro
>>;-)
>>
>>Cheers TT
>
> A couple of years ago I was very excited at Blu-Ray.
> Now its one big mess.
>
> The next format in HVD looked like they may have been going somewhere
> but they too are looking at copy protection which means they'll end up
> in the same mess as HD-DVD and Blu-Ray.
>
> Nano is the next one after HVD but they'll go and mess things up as
> well. No one leans from there mistakes these days.
>
> Stick with DVD. Its going to take years before these companies come to
> their senses with high capacity media/drives/players.
>
> Up convert or up scaling of DVD is where its all going now.
> Many DVD players with up scaling to near HD capacity.
> But if they keep on altering the plugs then there are going to be
> problems.
>
> If buying a TV set I'd make very sure it has at least two HDMI
> connections.
>
> Maybe someone will invent a converting cable to go from the old to the
> new. Who knows there maybe a cable that does that now.
>
> Anyway SED TV Sets are on the way. Shall be interesting to see if they
> still with the older HDMI or go with the new.
>
> SalesMart.com.au
> Perth, Western Australia
> http://www.salesmart.com.au
> *******************************************
> Email Contact info on the above site.
> *******************************************
>

[Ext User(Alan Rutlidge)]

"TT" <TTencerNOSPAM@westnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:44b04f13@quokka.wn.com.au...
>
> "Alan Rutlidge" <don't_spam_me_rutlidge@iinet.net.au> wrote
> in message
> news:44af828e$0$14063$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
>> Agreed Rick. The problem is some DVD-A discs don't come
> with a stereo
>> advanced resolution soundtrack and this means you need to
> put your DVD-A
>> player in to 2 channel mode, relying on the downmix
> facility and the
>> authoring of the disc to convert from 6 channels to 2. On
> some discs this
>> mixdown authoring is quite good, whilst on others it
> leaves a bit to be
>> desired. Just a pity not ALL DVD-A discs come with a
> dedicated 2 channel
>> advanced resolution track.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alan
>>
> And I should add the DVD-A that you are referring to here is
> Emerson, Lake and Palmer - Brain Salad Surgery. Classic
> case of where the mix-down is woeful.

And it's not the only title. :-(
>
> Another example is Deep Purple - Machine Head the bonus
> tracks are only in 6ch so if you want to listen to it also
> has to be down mixed.
>
> Is this a good time to talk about Dual-Disc and the way we
> get ripped off with advanced resolution of 48/16 and DD5.1
> as the surround mix? And that's if you're lucky!

Don't get me started. 48/16 is at least a bit better than 44.1/16 if you
don't need the dynamic range (questionable on most recordings). It's when
companies like Sony print stuff like "Enhanced Stereo" on DualDiscs which
actually means DD5.1 that peaves me orf.....
Nothing 'enhanced or stereo' about DD5.1

Cheers,
Alan


>
> Cheers TT
>
>

[Ext User(TT)]

"Alan Rutlidge" <don't_spam_me_rutlidge@iinet.net.au> wrote
in message
news:44b076f6$0$14104$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
>
> Don't get me started. 48/16 is at least a bit better than
44.1/16 if you
> don't need the dynamic range (questionable on most
recordings). It's when
> companies like Sony print stuff like "Enhanced Stereo" on
DualDiscs which
> actually means DD5.1 that peaves me orf.....
> Nothing 'enhanced or stereo' about DD5.1
>
> Cheers,
> Alan


As I said in my original post it's enough to make me start
buying lots of vinyl and CDs again.

All this crap that we are being dished out with at the
moment is turning me right off and *IF* anyone does a Sony
again and tries to install some "Root Kit" on my computer
I'll finish with buying CDs as well!

Really pissed TT >:-(

PS Funny story time. After I started this thread yesterday
I was in a certain electrical goods store and was checking
out 32" LCDs for a bedroom tele. Anyway the youngish sales
droid steers me away from a nice little Acer that has every
input except HDMI (had DVI) at $1750ish and drags me over to
a Sony and a NEC for a $1000+ more and obviously more
commission. So the sales spiel goes
"........................... and it's future proof it has
HDMI"

I say "HDMI 1, 1.1, 1.2 or the new 1.3"

He says "1.3 of course, it's the latest."

I say (in my best Phil Allison impression) "Liar! It's only
just been released and straight away that makes every set in
this store obsolete and no good for BluRay or HD-DVD unless
you import a first gen. player from Japan right now."

He says "So you want to start an argument?!" I left.

So what hope has the public in all this? Also Analog TV is
due to cut out in 2008 and here in rural WA our 2 commercial
TV stations WIN & GWN still do not provide any programming
in even SD little alone HD!

Arrrrrrrrggh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (pulling what hair
is left out)

[Ext User(Alan Rutlidge)]

"TT" <TTencerNOSPAM@westnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:44b09706$1@quokka.wn.com.au...
>
> "Alan Rutlidge" <don't_spam_me_rutlidge@iinet.net.au> wrote
> in message
> news:44b076f6$0$14104$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
>>
>> Don't get me started. 48/16 is at least a bit better than
> 44.1/16 if you
>> don't need the dynamic range (questionable on most
> recordings). It's when
>> companies like Sony print stuff like "Enhanced Stereo" on
> DualDiscs which
>> actually means DD5.1 that peaves me orf.....
>> Nothing 'enhanced or stereo' about DD5.1
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alan
>
>
> As I said in my original post it's enough to make me start
> buying lots of vinyl and CDs again.
>
> All this crap that we are being dished out with at the
> moment is turning me right off and *IF* anyone does a Sony
> again and tries to install some "Root Kit" on my computer
> I'll finish with buying CDs as well!
>
> Really pissed TT >:-(
>
> PS Funny story time. After I started this thread yesterday
> I was in a certain electrical goods store and was checking
> out 32" LCDs for a bedroom tele. Anyway the youngish sales
> droid steers me away from a nice little Acer that has every
> input except HDMI (had DVI) at $1750ish and drags me over to
> a Sony and a NEC for a $1000+ more and obviously more
> commission. So the sales spiel goes
> "........................... and it's future proof it has
> HDMI"
>
> I say "HDMI 1, 1.1, 1.2 or the new 1.3"
>
> He says "1.3 of course, it's the latest."

You should have purchased the said display, got them to deliver it, played
with it for a week or so then got them to come back and pick it up for a
full refund, citing misrepresentation of the goods at the point of sale (IOW
the droid told you it was HDMI V1.3 and in fact it wasn't).

>
> I say (in my best Phil Allison impression) "Liar! It's only
> just been released and straight away that makes every set in
> this store obsolete and no good for BluRay or HD-DVD unless
> you import a first gen. player from Japan right now."
>
> He says "So you want to start an argument?!" I left.

This kid is obviously stupider than he sounds. He hasn't seen your famous
picture with monkey wrench in hand has he?. :P
This wasn't a Halving Moron's pimply faced droid from the outdoor furniture
department was it, masquerading as an AV expert in his own lunchtime?
Surpassed only by Junior Blunder Hi-Fi salespersons.???
If you were bored shitless you should have involved the store manager. :-)
It would have been a great way to get the missus and daughter to vanish to
the bedding department. Snigger, snigger, snigger......

>
> So what hope has the public in all this? Also Analog TV is
> due to cut out in 2008 and here in rural WA our 2 commercial
> TV stations WIN & GWN still do not provide any programming
> in even SD little alone HD!
>
> Arrrrrrrrggh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (pulling what hair
> is left out)
>

Yep, but don't ye country folks get an extra year or two to catch up with
dem city slickers?

Cheers,
Alan

[Ext User(TT)]

"Alan Rutlidge" <don't_spam_me_rutlidge@iinet.net.au> wrote
in message
news:44b0dfe4$0$14082$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> This wasn't a Halving Moron's ..................>


> Cheers,
> Alan
>

Close but no banana ;-) Retravision.

Cheers TT

[Ext User(Brendan Pratt)]

TT said the following on 10/07/2006 12:28 AM:

> Close but no banana ;-) Retravision.

Yet another supermarket trolley boy who bought himself a iPod and thinks
he knows everything ?

;)

[Ext User(Jeßus)]

On Thu, 27 Jul 2006 16:00:06 +1000, Brendan Pratt proclaimed:

> TT said the following on 10/07/2006 12:28 AM:
>> Close but no banana ;-) Retravision.
>
> Yet another supermarket trolley boy who bought himself a iPod and thinks
> he knows everything ?
> ;)

Great... he's back.


--
/J/
Cut the crap to email me...
Webcam: http://homepages.picknowl.com.au/glen1070/x.jpg