Old Merc - big headache?

[Ext User(John GH)]

Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
an example like this...
http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612

I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
servicing, fluids, brakes.
I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?

Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

[Ext User(Andy)]

John GH wrote:
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.


"Old Merc" and "cheap 2nd car" don't belong in the same sentence.


> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?


Stupidly expensive.


> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

No.

HTH.

Andy.

[Ext User(atec 77)]

John GH wrote:
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?
>
>
you need it properly inspected as it can be a good car
or a money pit
parts are reasonable if you dont buy direct from merc australia

[Ext User(Ron)]

"John GH" <jgh@nomail.com> wrote in
news:134d06tdl2ds3a1@corp.supernews.com:

> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?
> id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the
> basic servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle
> repairs, but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

A far better buy would be the 300TDE.
The 230 is a 2.3 litre motor pushing a 1.6 tonne car!

I had a 250 many years ago and it was gutless and thirsty.

Have a look at:
http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/300/Melbourne/detail.aspx?
id=3496536&pg=1&pp=0&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1243047450

[Ext User(Scotty)]

"John GH" <jgh@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:134d06tdl2ds3a1@corp.supernews.com...
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?
>

John, Old and cheap only need be related at time of purchase. After that
'How longs a peice of string'?

I freinds brother had an old merc that shit itself (threw a leg out of bed)
and it actually ended up cheaper throwing in a freshened up 350 Chev than
even getting a second hand donk for the Merc. The suspention bits werent too
bad aparently but small items like door winders and mirrors costa shit load
unless you are a db hand at 'Retro fits'.

I reakon that they would be great of you could retro interchangable bits on
em.

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"John GH" <jgh@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:134d06tdl2ds3a1@corp.supernews.com...

> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

They can be a huge money pit.

They were advanced cars in their day compared to anything made here (then
again at around three times the money new they'd want to have been), but
they're not much today compared to anything built in the last few years or
so, including any of the cheap micro's. Their biggest problem is the source
of good used parts, and alloy engine components in usable condition are
extremely hard to come by.

Particularly cylinder head castings.

A friend of mine's father (who was actually an Air Vice Marshall of the RAAF
at the time, so he wasn't short of a dollar) had exactly this same model in
a sedan (a dark blue metallic) that was in absolutely *mint* condition apart
from the engine. In particular the cylinder head had corroded to the point
of the casting being unserviceable, and a useable replacement couldn't be
found in the country at all.

He ended up importing three head castings (one from the US and two from
Europe if I recall), and in the end the best of those would owe him more
money than the car was worth to recondition so he scrapped the car and
bought some new Japanese thing. As far as I know the car went to a wrecker
who repowered it with a late model Falcon engine & trans, and it's still
kicking around in Melbourne's west somewhere.

Apart from the engine problems (if they weren't enough) he had constant
trouble with the central locking (which was pneumatically controlled), self
leveling suspension, the auto and the power windows. It was a good car, but
it had bugs (as most of them seem to do) and after spending shitloads of
money on it over the years the cylinder head issue was enough to tip him
over the edge and walk away from it.

I guess the short answer is that there's nothing fantastic about them just
because they wear a Mercedes Benz badge (Benz make a *very* over-rated car
in my opinion), and you'd only *really* want one if you were an "enthusiast"
and enjoyed tinkering.

In that way, they're no different to an old Jag....

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Ext User(Albm&ctd)]

In article <464689a6$0$9074$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au>,
nospam@no.no says...
> John GH wrote:
> > Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
>
>
> "Old Merc" and "cheap 2nd car" don't belong in the same sentence.
>
>
> > an example like this...
> > http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
> >
> > I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> > servicing, fluids, brakes.
> > I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> > but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
>
> Stupidly expensive.
>
But probably no worse than an 84 Honda.

Al
--
I don't take sides.
It's more fun to insult everyone.
http://kwakakid.cjb.net/insult.html

[Ext User(Michael C)]

"John GH" <jgh@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:134d06tdl2ds3a1@corp.supernews.com...
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

I considered this myself but gave the idea away. The potential for spending
cash would be huge. The one you linked to looks shite though, something like
this looks 100 times better.

http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/380/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3304641&pg=2&pp=2&d=0&nv=1&SG=-434373265

I think noddy hit it on the head when he said you really need to be an
enthuist to get a 25 yo merc.

Michael

[Ext User(Cyborg 0019)]

John GH wrote:
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
> http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?
>
>

Have to agree with Scotty,About 20 years ago my uncle had a 1967
Merc,got it for $2000, motor and auto gave it up 1 month later,when he
took it to the local garage,all they could do was pop a holden 253 V8
and 4 speed in for $200.
He sold it for $5000,the day it was advertised is the day it
sold,considering the car $5k was cheap.

I acuallty wanted my parents to bye it as even then it was an absolute
classic in design,there was nothing like smoking up the rears at the
lights in an old Merc,it was just not the done thing,but it really
looked the part doing it...lol

[Ext User(jackbadger56)]

On May 13, 1:07 pm, "John GH" <j...@nomail.com> wrote:
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.asp...
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

6 months ago paid $3900 for a 280TE (1981 model) for our German Au
Pair to drive around Oz in. Has so for covered 25,000kms and is
currently in Darwin via Perth/melb./Adelaide/Syd. Had been fairly well
maintained (although no documented history) and all we did was replace
radiator before she left.
Thing is though, we were probably lucky. It can be a lottery.

[Ext User(Jason James)]

"John GH" <jgh@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:134d06tdl2ds3a1@corp.supernews.com...
> Considering an old Merc as a cheap 2nd car.
> an example like this...
>
http://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/MERCEDES-BENZ/230/Sydney/detail.aspx?id=3487039&pg=1&pp=4&d=0&nv=1&SG=-1234128612
>
> I've never had anything to do with cars like this. I usually do the basic
> servicing, fluids, brakes.
> I often see exotics at my local mechanic so I'd say he can handle repairs,
> but how exp. are parts for a beast like this?
>
> Should a well looked after Merc with 256000km on it be ok ?

Its got too many ks on it from a suspension point of view. Unless it has had
regular repairs as needed. I would pay attention to (apart from the
suspension) top rad-tank. Put finger in hole and scrape around under the top
of tank for any rust coloured crud. Check for driveline noises vibrations,
slop. Do similar check of oil-hole. If its a well serviced car, Id offer
considerabley less than asking price.

Jason

[Ext User(Richard Sherratt)]

On Sun, 13 May 2007 14:52:30 +1000, "Noddy"
<dg4163@(nospam)dodo.com.au> wrote:

<snip>

>They were advanced cars in their day compared to anything made here (then
>again at around three times the money new they'd want to have been)

<snip>

Advanced? I like your subtle sarcasm :-) Basic cars hyped to hell by
ignorant Australian motoring journalists. Live in Germany for many
years and you see a different picture :-)

>In that way, they're no different to an old Jag....

Depending on the year, probably not as reliable as a Jag. Mercs come
in close to Ladas and Trabants as far as reliability goes.

--
Regards.
Richard.

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"Richard Sherratt" <richard.sherratt@NOTHINGHEREbrunsley.com.au> wrote in
message

> Advanced? I like your subtle sarcasm :-) Basic cars hyped to hell by
> ignorant Australian motoring journalists. Live in Germany for many
> years and you see a different picture :-)

You're obviously completely ignorant of Australian built cars of that era :)

> Depending on the year, probably not as reliable as a Jag.

That's pretty good considering Jaguars are one of the most *appallingly*
unreliable cars ever made. I've never been a Benz fan, but even I wouldn't
lump them in exactly the same basket. Not all that far removed, sure, but
not on the exact same level.

> Mercs come in close to Ladas and Trabants as far as reliability goes.

I wouldn't go that far.

Older Mercs are a headache today, but they weren't overly troublesome new.
Similarly, currently models don't have anything specific wrong with them
apart from being extremely over-rated.

If they have any particular weakness at all, it's the quality of their
aluminium alloy material used in their cast engine components. It's
extremely prone to corrosion. By far the worst I've ever seen in my time
(excluding anything made in Italy of course), and apparently not all that
flash today.

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Ext User(Richard Sherratt)]

On Tue, 15 May 2007 22:08:54 +1000, "Noddy"
<dg4163@(nospam)dodo.com.au> wrote:

>
>"Richard Sherratt" <richard.sherratt@NOTHINGHEREbrunsley.com.au> wrote in
>message
>
>> Advanced? I like your subtle sarcasm :-) Basic cars hyped to hell by
>> ignorant Australian motoring journalists. Live in Germany for many
>> years and you see a different picture :-)
>
>You're obviously completely ignorant of Australian built cars of that era :)

"Buy a Kingswood or a Falcon. They never break down." That's what I
was told when I arrived here in the 1970s.

>> Depending on the year, probably not as reliable as a Jag.
>
>That's pretty good considering Jaguars are one of the most *appallingly*
>unreliable cars ever made.

That's something else that puzzled me when I arrived here. Jaguar had
the reputation in Europe of being one of the most reliable cars. So
much so that the British army specified jag engines for their scorpion
light tanks because they were the most reliable. This was before the
horror years when the company was run by accountants instead of
engineers.

<snip>

>Older Mercs are a headache today, but they weren't overly troublesome new.

They weren't designed to be long-lived cars. Germans I knew in Germany
traded them in after one or two years.

>Similarly, currently models don't have anything specific wrong with them
>apart from being extremely over-rated.

Mind you, I wouldn't say no to an SL63AMG :-)

>If they have any particular weakness at all, it's the quality of their
>aluminium alloy material used in their cast engine components. It's
>extremely prone to corrosion. By far the worst I've ever seen in my time
>(excluding anything made in Italy of course), and apparently not all that
>flash today.

And the electrics. Though they do seem to be trying to get that right
these days.

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"Richard Sherratt" <richard.sherratt@NOTHINGHEREbrunsley.com.au> wrote in
message

> "Buy a Kingswood or a Falcon. They never break down." That's what I
> was told when I arrived here in the 1970s.

You were obviously lied to.

Big time :)

> That's something else that puzzled me when I arrived here. Jaguar had
> the reputation in Europe of being one of the most reliable cars. So
> much so that the British army specified jag engines for their scorpion
> light tanks because they were the most reliable. This was before the
> horror years when the company was run by accountants instead of
> engineers.

Kinda, but not really.

The British used them in an effort to support the local industry, being
patriotic and all that, but even then the engines they used were radically
modified from the engine you'd find in your average car, and only made
something like 120 horsepower when configured as such.

Jaguars, as a vehicle, have always had problems and not just with the
engines.

> They weren't designed to be long-lived cars. Germans I knew in Germany
> traded them in after one or two years.

Bit of a different environment though.

I mean, in Germany they use Benz's as cabs like we do Holdens & Falcons
here, and their base models are no more expensive to buy there than a base
model Falcadore. Over here, the cheapest Benz you could buy was two to three
times the price of your average Holden, Ford or Valiant, and they were
immediately seen as "luxury" vehicles based on price alone.

Whether they actually were or not is beside the point. They cost a hell of a
lot of money.

> Mind you, I wouldn't say no to an SL63AMG :-)

I wouldn't either, but only to sell it and buy an M5 :)

> And the electrics. Though they do seem to be trying to get that right
> these days.

They've got a *very* long way to go before they catch Jaguar or Volvo on
that score in my opinion :)

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[devon1]

It's not the car make you have to wary about it's the treatment from previous owners the car received you have to wary about.
I had a pleasure to drive brand new 500SEL and I owed 7 years old 280SE and now I bought 20 years old 280SE. The person who sold it to me was a lying asswhole and the car had many problems. So it cost me 3 grand to fix those problems and I will have a car for next 20 years that cost me 6000 bucks. With regards to the cost of spare parts, they are not expensive if youk now where to look and there is not a good reason why car mechanic should charge you more per hour to service Merc then he would charge you for servicing a Falcom , Holden or any other car. And for the people who compare a Merc to a Jag unless you are a midget you would never suggested the Jag.
I spent few yaers driving all sort of cars Jags (under dures),RR,Bentley Turbo Mulsannes and many other "luxury cars", a well as Holdens,Falcons and Valiants. As my mechanic says, The Mercedes is not a luxury car it is a quality car. You can prove it to your self easy, slam the door on any other 20 year old car and the do it on Merc, you will hear it.

[devon1]

It's not the car make you have to worry about it's the treatment from previous owners the car received you have to worry about.
I had a pleasure to drive a brand new 500SEL and I owned 7 years old 280SE and now I bought 20 years old 280SE. The person who sold it to me was a lying asswhole and the car had many problems. So it cost me 3 grand to fix those problems and I will have a car for next 20 years that cost me 6000 bucks. With regards to the cost of spare parts, they are not expensive if you know where to look and there is not a good reason why a car mechanic should charge you more per hour to service Merc then he would charge you for servicing a Falcom , Holden or any other car. And for the people who compare a Merc to a Jag unless you are a midget you would never suggested the Jag.
I spent few years driving all sort of cars Jags (under dures),RR,Bentley Turbo Mulsannes and many other "luxury cars", as well as Holdens,Falcons and Valiants. My first choice(for comfort) is Bentley or RR and second is Merc.As my mechanic says, The Mercedes is not a luxury car it is a quality car. You can prove it to your self easy, slam the door on any other 20 year old car and the do it on Merc, you will hear it.