Childhood indoctrination

[femme fatale]

Here's a nice little site for our kiddies to learn all about the world. :) :) :)

http://www.answersingenesis.org/kids

http://www.answersingenesis.org/cec/vbs/amazon-expedition/




...and of course :rolling: ...

http://www.answersingenesis.org/kids/good-news

[Leroy Peterson]

Only in America :rolling:

Even in our RE classes, we get taught that the Old Testament is Myth, stories...
That is officially sick

[custos]

There's lots of good stuff on the internet...

http://www.aryan-nations.org/


It's not a matter of White Supremacy it's about Racial Purity!

Our Motto: Violence solves everything

Jew praising Judeo-Christian freaks should be treated no differently than the jewish scum they support and admire! Even though many are of our race they are nothing less than traitors. Fact is ALL that dance to the tune of the jew should and will be exterminated with the jew!

One of the biggest offenders in my opinion is any so-called pastor that teaches demonic jewry are gods chosen people. In my humble opinion this rabble should be nailed to the alter in their churches and immolated! This sends a much better message than simply burning down an empty structure.

Christianity is nothing more than jewish fables to keep our Aryan race dumbed down and docile. Until our Aryan brother and sisters wake to the fact that this religion is not for them, no matter how it's interpreted or packaged, they will in fact remain servants to the jew and this Zionist run system. Anything that deters or detracts from our goal of freeing our once White nations from this jew subjugation and the infestation of mongrel hoards that inhabit presently should be done away with.

There should be NO stumbling blocks be it religion, beliefs or morality that come between us and our goals of freeing our people and nations from this jewish filth and their non-white hoards that they have welcomed to our shores. As I have been saying for years, nothing but VIOLENCE upon our enemies will accomplish anything. Public marches, rallies, meetings, etc., foster nothing but unneeded attention into our business by local and federal police authorities. If this is what you feel you must do then you may as well head down to the local police precinct and asked to be booked.

[Hermit]

There's lots of good stuff on the internet...
There is indeed, but the website you provided the link for is not aiming at children in particular. The ones Femme fatale pointed out are plainly focusing at subteens, telling them reassuring (not) things like: "God said that death was the punishment for sin."

Sprouting racial prejudice to anyone who cares to read the page does not compare to the cruelty of ramming "the fear of God" into a four or eight year old child.

[custos]

A four or eight year old child should not be roaming the Internet unchaperoned in the first place. There are much more serious, or at least immediate, dangers than religious propaganda.

[femme fatale]

A four or eight year old child should not be roaming the Internet unchaperoned in the first place. There are much more serious, or at least immediate, dangers than religious propaganda.Of course.

I'm concerned for those children who are directed to such sites, by their parents and educators. They are being taught lies about science, and the tool to manipulate their minds is, as always, fear of alienation from god. New people's minds being corrupted at their most vulnerable developmental stage. The next step these fundamentalists take is to put the fear of eternal damnation into older children and teens, and feed them more lies about science, through those dispicable cartoon tracts, like the ones Chick (http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/1107/1107_01.asp?wpc=1107_01.asp&wpp=a) produces. This is child abuse, and like any form of child abuse should not be tolerated.

[Drifter]

A four or eight year old child should not be roaming the Internet unchaperoned in the first place. There are much more serious, or at least immediate, dangers than religious propaganda.

So, just as there is filtering software to prevent children accidentally surfing the net and finding porn, perhaps there should be filtering software to prevent unchaperoned tots accidentally stumbling across religious indoctrination sites. Instead of filters that search and ban sites because of words like "sex", "breasts" etc these filters should block access to sites which feature words like "church", "Jesus", "sin", "salvation" etc. ;)

[Lizard Drinkin]

So, just as there is filtering software to prevent children accidentally surfing the net and finding porn, perhaps there should be filtering software to prevent unchaperoned tots accidentally stumbling across religious indoctrination sites. Instead of filters that search and ban sites because of words like "sex", "breasts" etc these filters should block access to sites which feature words like "church", "Jesus", "sin", "salvation" etc. ;)
Filtering software = adult fucking supervision :rolling: The interwebs are not a toy.

[custos]

Filtering software = adult f***ing supervision :rolling: The interwebs are not a toy.

Right on the money.

[femme fatale]

I'd like to change the thread title to 'Childhood indoctrination' to open this topic up to include more general indoctrination methods and perhaps include forms of indoctrination, other than religious. Watcher or tues, could you, please? :)


I recently came across the following clip of Dave Allen's - his take on religious indoctrination from a personal perspective as a small boy, being introduced to it for the first time. It is, of course typical Dave Allen humour, and there are some lol moments, but the underlying cruelty he is illustrating is undeniable.

Dave Allen on religion. (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=jxo81Ok9Urk)






.

[Randy]

To play devils advocate, you have to consider the opposite viewpoint. If religion is valid and god does exist, then wouldn't forcing children into a world without god, be as bad as forcing them into a world with god?

Its not the same as the title post, but that's an extreme case of indoctrination. You could have a similarly offensive opposite where children are persecuted for being religious. (it does happen, just not necessarily by atheists).

I think its a narrow viewpoint, that you can postulate what a child can and can't learn. The entire basis of our society is freedom, and that intrinsically refers to the freedom to teach your children to believe in whatever you want.

Like i said, its not exactly analogous to the title thread, but just something i think that should be kept in mind...

[Lizard Drinkin]

I think its a narrow viewpoint, that you can postulate what a child can and can't learn. The entire basis of our society is freedom, and that intrinsically refers to the freedom to teach your children to believe in whatever you want.
I agree with much you say on this, but this point is debatable. It comes down to a child's right to make up their own mind, in which case it would be a matter of "freedom to expose your child to your particular way of thinking" as opposed to teaching them to "believe".

[Randy]

I agree with much you say on this, but this point is debatable. It comes down to a child's right to make up their own mind, in which case it would be a matter of "freedom to expose your child to your particular way of thinking" as opposed to teaching them to "believe".Its a utopian viewpoint, and one which only applies in theory alone. It would be a great world where children could make all the choices they wanted, but we don't live in that world. Kids are hideously uninformed about the world. and can't be expected to make valued judgements on elements that will affect the rest of their lives (of cause i'm talking young children here). Kids under 10 years old, can't even be charged with a criminal offence, because its deemed that they are incapable of understanding the full implications of their actions.

So i say, placing important elements of a childs up bring squarely on the child is under-parenting. Its finding a means of delegating the blame for possible failures in the child's life, off parents hands and onto the childs. The reason why parents exist on this earth, is to form their children into adults. It doesn't happen naturally. (i know a few people who aren't even there yet)

take this for example. a basic element in child psychology is the fact that children seek pleasure and attempt to escape pain. While this is a natural response, it isn't practical. Given the choice between going to church and playing the Xbox, they will choose the Xbox. Give the choice to decide what sport to play outside school, They'll choose not to choose. Personal advancement is formed from pain. Which is in opposition to a childs natural mindset.

So i happen to disagree that a child should be able to make its own choices regarding elements as important as religion. I believe its a parents responsibility to expose their child to as much of the world as possible, and, through time, allow that child to seek their own path, when they are capable, when they have enough information to do so. to attempt to sum up in a Dr Phill style quote. "When your driving, you don't let kids have control of the wheel, because in the end, they have no idea where they're going" Probably not as good as Dr Phill... But hey, he gets paid way more than me!

EDIT: well after that rant... i re-read your post and realised i just said the same thing you did... I'm keeping the post though... took me a while to write...

[Hermit]

I believe its a parents responsibility to expose their child to as much of the world as possible, and, through time, allow that child to seek their own path, when they are capable, when they have enough information to do so.
I thought that's what Lizard Drinkin said. You don't tell the child that if it sins it is certain to go to hell and burn forever on one hand. On the other you don't tell the child that there is proof that god does not exist either.

Earlier, Femme Fatale posted a link that pokes fun at the cruelty involved when you engage in the former as documented in the film Jesus Camp, for example. Here it is again: Dave Allen, age 5, is introduced to religion. (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=jxo81Ok9Urk)

[Randy]

I thought that's what Lizard Drinkin said.I already addressed that

You don't tell the child that if it sins it is certain to go to hell and burn forever on one hand. On the other you don't tell the child that there is proof that god does not exist either.
Earlier, Femme Fatale posted a link that pokes fun at the cruelty involved when you engage in the former as documented in the film Jesus Camp, for example. Here it is again: Dave Allen, age 5, is introduced to religion. (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=jxo81Ok9Urk)Well... its their prerogative to expose their children to whatever tools they need to form them into productive adults. "don't kill someone or you'll go to hell and burn for the rest of eternity" has worked well in keeping people from killing each other. Why change it now just because you don't believe that they'll burn forever...

If you were American, it would be just as valid to say to your children "Don't kill or we'll kill you!". Just because its distasteful, doesn't mean its not an adequate tool with which to teach. We use Grotesque images of decaying mutilated bodies to wean kids and adults of smoking (or starting it up).

The tool works. Why refrain from using it, because you don't think they need it?

There are many ways forms of patenting. None are adequate enough to enforce on others. because ultimately, whether or not your particular viewpoint on parenting works or not is a matter of chance. The stick works well for some kids, jet turns others into bastards. The carrot works well for some kids, jet turns others into incompetent morons...

Knowing that, how can you enforce one or the other on anyone else?

[femme fatale]

Children often ask questions which should be an opportunity to encourage critical thinking and learning based on empirical science ... or they can be told the TRUTH™ :rolleyes: :

Questions Kids Ask (http://www.holyspiritinteractive.net/kids/questions/)


What is Heaven Like?

The Bible uses some wonderful pictures to tell us what heaven is like. In our world, we think that gold is important because it's so valuable. But in heaven, the streets will be gold—we'll walk on it. The best way to picture heaven is to imagine the most exciting and fun place that you've ever been to. Heaven will be like that, only much, much better. Jesus told his followers that he was leaving earth to go to heaven to prepare a place for them. He has a special place for us, where there is no crying or sadness and we will be filled with joy.

Why Can't We See God?

We can't see God because he's invisible. But we can see what he does. Balloons are filled with air that we can't see, but we see the balloon get big as the air is put in. Radio waves are invisible, but they exist. Just because we can't see God doesn't mean he isn't real. Believing that God is there even though we can't see him is faith. Someday, in heaven, we will see God face to face.

How Does God Make The Sun And Moon Go Up And Down?

God made powerful laws to govern the universe. These laws control the movements of the sun, moon, earth, and other planets and stars. For example, one law called "gravity" draws objects toward each other. Other natural laws control the weather. Many forces determine whether the day will be sunny or cloudy, warm or cold, such as the heat from the sun, the currents in the ocean, the wind, and many others. God set up the rules that make all these forces work together. And because God controls the entire universe, he can interrupt the laws if he wants to - bring rain to dry land or bright sunshine to flooded areas. How powerful God must be to control all that!
...and my choice for absolute ego perverting garbage:

Why Does God Let Us Get Sick?

Sometimes sickness is the body's way of telling us that we should stop living a certain way. Perhaps we ate too much (or we ate something bad). Or we didn't get enough sleep. Sickness and disease are problems that came into the world with sin. All kinds of people get sick: good and bad, rich and poor, old and young. God wants us to take care of ourself and be healthy so we can live for him. And when we are sick, we can pray to God and ask him to help us.

Sometimes I despair for the developing minds and psyches of young children. :(

[Randy]

...and my choice for absolute ego perverting garbage:

Why Does God Let Us Get Sick?

Sometimes sickness is the body's way of telling us that we should stop living a certain way. Perhaps we ate too much (or we ate something bad). Or we didn't get enough sleep. Sickness and disease are problems that came into the world with sin. All kinds of people get sick: good and bad, rich and poor, old and young. God wants us to take care of ourself and be healthy so we can live for him. And when we are sick, we can pray to God and ask him to help us.

Sometimes I despair for the developing minds and psyches of young children. :(Isn't that just the concept of karma, illustrated bluntly?

[femme fatale]

Do you think AIDS is karmic? Or is it caused by a virus?

How about malaria? Karmic, or caused by a transmission of infection by a tiny flying insect?

...and cancer? Is that a result of sin, or is it a disease brought about by aggressive changes in cell structure? Even fetuses can develop cancer.

[Randy]

No. I also don't believe in karma.

But they're essentially the same principals. Karma says that good things will happen to the good, and bad things will happen to the bad. (there are many views and definitions of karma, but that is one). So if your bad, bad things will happen to you... That's just not true. If you throw a tantrum in front of your mother, your not going to be speared through the eye by a passing meteorite.

So you should find karma abhorrent too.

Religion isn't true, its all a lie. Why pick just that one part of religion. How about the Christian viewpoint that if you commit one of the 7 deadly sins, you'll go to hell and burn for all eternity? Steal a toy doll from a pawn shop when you 7, and you spend the afterlife with the devil...

What about the catholic viewpoint that contraception is a sin, and if you use it you'll be sent to purgatory (may not be true, but i think that's right).

[femme fatale]

I don't single any one aspect of dogma, indoctrination or superstition out, I use examples. My point is that children are being discouraged from thinking critically and from basing their knowledge on tried and tested sound empirical evidence. Anything else, when claimed as absolute knowledge, or TRUTH™, is just outright deception. The methods (the implication of sinfulness and associated threats) used to discourage critical thinking is abhorrent.