OT: What if?

[Ext User(RogerM)]

I've still been thinking about this apology and all the political
correctness bullshit and snowballing effect ($'s) that will go with it. Have
they really considered the other side of the equation? I
mean......................

What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from the
squalor of their upbringing?

What if the children had of died from sickness and diseases?

What if those children who were raped and brutalised then committed suicide?

What if the giving of the gift of a second chance in life never happened?

What if the governments of the day were really "trying" to help?

What if we did all the above, would we be saying sorry today for not
"trying" to help?

Can you add to this?

Roger :>(

[Ext User(John_H)]

RogerM wrote:
>
>What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from the
>squalor of their upbringing?

Which is totally irrelevant to the real reason they were taken
away.... To save their souls for Jesus!

If there's to be compensation involved, then every church that ever
sent forth a missionary should be required to take up a collection!

The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.

--
John H

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...

> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.

The rest of us don't owe them jack.

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Ext User(RogerM)]

"Noddy" <me@home.com> wrote in message
news:47b4056e$0$59787$c30e37c6@lon-reader.news.telstra.net...
>
> "John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
> news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...
>
>> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.
>
> The rest of us don't owe them jack.
>
> --
> Regards,
> Noddy.

I don't reckon we do either, for the reasons given in the original post.

Roger

[Ext User(Mikia)]

"RogerM" <RogerM@justrucks.net.au> wrote in message
news:13r7julnapipiab@corp.supernews.com...
> I've still been thinking about this apology and all the political
> correctness bullshit and snowballing effect ($'s) that will go with it.
> Have they really considered the other side of the equation? I
> mean......................
>
> What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from
> the squalor of their upbringing?
>
> What if the children had of died from sickness and diseases?
>
> What if those children who were raped and brutalised then committed
> suicide?
>
> What if the giving of the gift of a second chance in life never happened?
>
> What if the governments of the day were really "trying" to help?
>
> What if we did all the above, would we be saying sorry today for not
> "trying" to help?
>
> Can you add to this?
>
> Roger :>(
>
>

What if it happened to you?

Nah because it won't you can relax and be a typical armchair hypocrite.

[Ext User(Doug Jewell)]

RogerM wrote:
> I've still been thinking about this apology and all the political
> correctness bullshit and snowballing effect ($'s) that will go with it. Have
> they really considered the other side of the equation? I
> mean......................
>
> What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from the
> squalor of their upbringing?
>
> What if the children had of died from sickness and diseases?
>
> What if those children who were raped and brutalised then committed suicide?
>
> What if the giving of the gift of a second chance in life never happened?
>
> What if the governments of the day were really "trying" to help?
>
> What if we did all the above, would we be saying sorry today for not
> "trying" to help?
>
> Can you add to this?
>
> Roger :>(
Exactly - and what is ignored is that at the time there were
also plenty of white kids taken away from their parents and
put in the care of other families.
The same still happens today, but the various government
departments who are responsible are less likely to take
children from their homes - hence we have seen a rise in
child abuse - sometimes even leading to death - and we see
the rise in both black and white.
Do we take the kids out of their homes for their own
protection, and risk creating a whole new "stolen
generation"? or do we simply leave them where they are so
they suffer abuse?
Perhaps in some cases the problems can be solved by
addressing the problems with the parents, but in many cases
these are so ingrained that ultimately the child will need
to be removed for it's own safety.

[Ext User(Klompmeester)]

"John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...
> RogerM wrote:
>>
>>What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from
>>the
>>squalor of their upbringing?
>
> Which is totally irrelevant to the real reason they were taken
> away.... To save their souls for Jesus!
>
> If there's to be compensation involved, then every church that ever
> sent forth a missionary should be required to take up a collection!
>
> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.

I'm not sorry, and it's another reason not to get naturalised so I can
remain that way.

It had nothing to do with me and I won't have someone else apologise on my
behalf for something I'm in no way responsible for.

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"Klompmeester" <whowhere@andwhy.com> wrote in message
news:13r98s1h798t8b8@corp.supernews.com...

> I'm not sorry, and it's another reason not to get naturalised so I can
> remain that way.

You don't have to avoid "de-wogging" just so you don't have to be sorry :)

> It had nothing to do with me and I won't have someone else apologise on my
> behalf for something I'm in no way responsible for.

Agreed 100%

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Ext User(jackbadger56)]

On Feb 14, 4:21 pm, "RogerM" <Rog...@justrucks.net.au> wrote:
> I've still been thinking about this [[snip]]

no you fucking haven't.

>
> What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from the
> squalor of their upbringing?

What sort of squalor existed before white settlement?

>
> What if the children had of died from sickness and diseases?

Are you referring to the diseases introduced due to settlement?

>
> What if those children who were raped and brutalised then committed suicide?

What if grog hadn't been introduced into their culture?

>
> What if the giving of the gift of a second chance in life never happened?

It was only settlement that fucked up their first chance.

>
> What if the governments of the day were really "trying" to help?

Utterly beside the point.

>
> What if we did all the above, would we be saying sorry today for not
> "trying" to help?

Yeah, we've been a great help. Here ya go blackfella, have some rum!

>
> Can you add to this?

Fuck off you blinkered idiot and get back to talking about cars,
you're almost good at that but this subject is beyond you.

>
> Roger :>(

[Ext User(John_H)]

Klompmeester wrote:
>"John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
>news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...
>> RogerM wrote:
>>>
>>>What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from
>>>the
>>>squalor of their upbringing?
>>
>> Which is totally irrelevant to the real reason they were taken
>> away.... To save their souls for Jesus!
>>
>> If there's to be compensation involved, then every church that ever
>> sent forth a missionary should be required to take up a collection!
>>
>> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.
>
>I'm not sorry, and it's another reason not to get naturalised so I can
>remain that way.
>
>It had nothing to do with me and I won't have someone else apologise on my
>behalf for something I'm in no way responsible for.

My lot's been here for 150 years or so (on both sides) and likewise
the wife's. Not a forced immigrant among the lot of 'em but no
shortage of God botherers (especially on the wife's side)... for which
I deeply apologise.

We did of course civilise the place for the rest of you so it's
probably time to show your gratitude and have yourself neutralised!

FWIW some of my mother's forebears, on her mother's side, went to
Canada at the same time as hers came here, one of whom got himself
scalped by Indians. I have no idea whether the survivors have
apologised to them.

Likewise the old man's side, part of which went to South Africa.

--
John H

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"jackbadger56" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:041b50ca-7870-455a-aba4-

> Fuck off you blinkered idiot and get back to talking about cars,
> you're almost good at that but this subject is beyond you.

So, I'm guessing you're really passionate about this subject, huh? :)

If I can offer some advice, I'd say before you criticise *everyone* who
doesn't see things as you do you take a trip to an Aboriginal community and
have a look at how things *really* are. I have, and it was a real eye
opener.

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Ext User(jackbadger56)]

On Feb 15, 9:50 am, "Noddy" <m...@home.com> wrote:
> "jackbadger56" <castl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:041b50ca-7870-455a-aba4-
>
> > Fuck off you blinkered idiot and get back to talking about cars,
> > you're almost good at that but this subject is beyond you.
>
> So, I'm guessing you're really passionate about this subject, huh? :)
>
> If I can offer some advice, I'd say before you criticise *everyone* who
> doesn't see things as you do you take a trip to an Aboriginal community and
> have a look at how things *really* are. I have, and it was a real eye
> opener.
>
> --
> Regards,
> Noddy.

Step sister calls my step dad every week in tears. She's up in the NT
as part of the intervention. She's getting paid quite well and I doubt
saving the world was her first priority. She's emotionally tough (or
was) yet what she is seeing is breaking her. Unfortunately, *every*
*single* *incident* regarding abuse she's had to deal with in the last
4 months has been brought on by alcohol. Biologically, Aboriginals'
bodies haven't had the 1000's of years to get used to alcohol, they've
had 200.
BTW actually I'm not really that passionate about the plight of
Abbo's, I just hate it when firstly everyone seems to be an expert on
shit they really don't understand, and secondly I'm sick of politics
permeating aus.cars to such an extent. I know I should just leave
these OT posts alone so I shouldn't criticise, but when we're actually
talking about cars it's a great escape! ;-)

[Ext User(RogerM)]

"jackbadger56" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:041b50ca-7870-455a-aba4-731774b7737c@t55g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 14, 4:21 pm, "RogerM" <Rog...@justrucks.net.au> wrote:
>> I've still been thinking about this [[snip]]
>
> no you fucking haven't.

Oh sorry, but I have and still am.

>> What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from
>> the
>> squalor of their upbringing?
>
> What sort of squalor existed before white settlement?

You don't know your history very well if you think they were exempt from
sickness, which was mostly fatal.

>> What if the children had of died from sickness and diseases?
>
> Are you referring to the diseases introduced due to settlement?

That's always the same old story.

>> What if those children who were raped and brutalised then committed
>> suicide?
>
> What if grog hadn't been introduced into their culture?

Not all drink grog.

>> What if the giving of the gift of a second chance in life never happened?
>
> It was only settlement that fucked up their first chance.

So where would they be today if the whites stayed away

>> What if the governments of the day were really "trying" to help?
>
> Utterly beside the point.

No it's not, it's the whole fucking point of the topic. If you really
believe the whites were told to do this through some "ethnic cleansing"
bullshit, then it's no wonder you can't see the other side.

>> What if we did all the above, would we be saying sorry today for not
>> "trying" to help?
>
> Yeah, we've been a great help. Here ya go blackfella, have some rum!

No, more like "your children are dying and are being mistreated, we want to
help you".

>> Can you add to this?
>
> Fuck off you blinkered idiot and get back to talking about cars,
> you're almost good at that but this subject is beyond you.

Jack, your attitude is one of being lead by the "bleeding heart brigade".
All I asked for you today was to consider the alternative, something you
continue to close your eyes to. As you can't see that, it would be difficult
to have any sort of discussion with you. My partner and I still have heavy
discussion on this subject as she is easily lead as well and thinks along
your lines.

Do you deny the following?
1. The giving of doctors and free medical care
2. The building of homes which are often vandalised and destroyed
3. The giving of ree travel anywhere, whenever.
4. The giving to each and every family member $100.00 and
free travel to attend an aboriginal funeral.
5. The non charging of rent on any lands that white people have
to pay. There are always "land rights" claims before the courts.
6. The giving of interest free loans.
7. The giving of $8,000.00 each towards each daughters' wedding
8. The payment of $1.7 billion per year for 250,000 people,
which is $48,000.00 per man, woman and child.

I guess you're right, we are very unfair.

Roger

[Ext User(Daryl Walford)]

Klompmeester wrote:
> "John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
> news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...
>> RogerM wrote:
>>> What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from
>>> the
>>> squalor of their upbringing?
>> Which is totally irrelevant to the real reason they were taken
>> away.... To save their souls for Jesus!
>>
>> If there's to be compensation involved, then every church that ever
>> sent forth a missionary should be required to take up a collection!
>>
>> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.
>
> I'm not sorry, and it's another reason not to get naturalised so I can
> remain that way.

Thats ok, we don't want you anyway:-)
>
> It had nothing to do with me and I won't have someone else apologise on my
> behalf for something I'm in no way responsible for.
>
>

Thats not what happened, the PM apologized for the actions of past
Govts, not for the actions of the current Govt or any individual.


Daryl

[Ext User(jackbadger56)]

On Feb 15, 1:38 pm, "RogerM" <Rog...@justrucks.net.au> wrote:
> "jackbadger56" <castl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:041b50ca-7870-455a-aba4-731774b7737c@t55g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Feb 14, 4:21 pm, "RogerM" <Rog...@justrucks.net.au> wrote:
> >> I've still been thinking about this [[snip]]
>
> > no you fucking haven't.
>
> Oh sorry, but I have and still am.
>
> >> What if the bad whites of the day did nothing to take the children from
> >> the
> >> squalor of their upbringing?
>
> > What sort of squalor existed before white settlement?
>
> You don't know your history very well if you think they were exempt from
> sickness, which was mostly fatal.

You don't know your history well if you believe all sickness was
mostly fatal and had absolutely no home-spun yet often very effective
remedies.

>
> >> What if the children had of died from sickness and diseases?
>
>
>
> > Are you referring to the diseases introduced due to settlement?
>
> That's always the same old story.

Right. Note to everyone here that only the latest whiz-bang flash
space-age answers are acceptable.

>
> >> What if those children who were raped and brutalised then committed
> >> suicide?
>
> > What if grog hadn't been introduced into their culture?
>
> Not all drink grog.

Not all abuse children/act like criminals/drain the system etc
etc......

>
> >> What if the giving of the gift of a second chance in life never happened?
>
> > It was only settlement that fucked up their first chance.
>
> So where would they be today if the whites stayed away

Probably still living off the land and generally minding their own
business. This may be a cliche and difficult for you to believe/
understand, but they had a vibrant, relatively cohesive, and proud
culture before we arrived.

>
> >> What if the governments of the day were really "trying" to help?
>
> > Utterly beside the point.
>
> No it's not, it's the whole fucking point of the topic. If you really
> believe the whites were told to do this through some "ethnic cleansing"
> bullshit, then it's no wonder you can't see the other side.

The other side. Right. You are as guilty as anyone in refusing to
accept opposing views.

Thing is, ALL the issues we're currently trying to deal with here are
to do with "their" integration into "our" society. Whether or not
early intervention was meant with good intentions or not doesn't
change the fact it *didn't fucking work* and made things a whole lot
worse. Indigenous people are so primative by our standards, yet we
throw money at them (which they don't really understand) and build
unsuitable "houses" for them to our own liking, and basically dictate
to them how we are going to solve "their" issues?
Our efforts so far are akin to appraising a patient's malady as being
a broken neck by using only their postcode, administering
chemotherapy.......and wondering why it doesn't fix the problem!!!


>
> >> What if we did all the above, would we be saying sorry today for not
> >> "trying" to help?
>
> > Yeah, we've been a great help. Here ya go blackfella, have some rum!
>
> No, more like "your children are dying and are being mistreated, we want to
> help you".

.....sorry, did you accuse *me* of being a bleeding heart?

>
> >> Can you add to this?
>
> > Fuck off you blinkered idiot and get back to talking about cars,
> > you're almost good at that but this subject is beyond you.
>
> Jack, your attitude is one of being lead by the "bleeding heart brigade".
> All I asked for you today was to consider the alternative, something you
> continue to close your eyes to. As you can't see that, it would be difficult
> to have any sort of discussion with you. My partner and I still have heavy
> discussion on this subject as she is easily lead as well and thinks along
> your lines.
>
> Do you deny the following?
> 1. The giving of doctors and free medical care
> 2. The building of homes which are often vandalised and destroyed
> 3. The giving of ree travel anywhere, whenever.
> 4. The giving to each and every family member $100.00 and
> free travel to attend an aboriginal funeral.
> 5. The non charging of rent on any lands that white people have
> to pay. There are always "land rights" claims before the courts.
> 6. The giving of interest free loans.
> 7. The giving of $8,000.00 each towards each daughters' wedding
> 8. The payment of $1.7 billion per year for 250,000 people,
> which is $48,000.00 per man, woman and child.
>
> I guess you're right, we are very unfair.

.......you forgot 'totally misguided'.

>
> Roger

[[[obligatory smiley face here]]]

[Ext User(Feral Al)]

jackbadger56 wrote:

> yet we throw money at them (which they don't really understand)

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

SORRY. I'll go now.

--
Take Care. ~~
Feral Al ( @..@)
(\- :-P -/)
((.>__oo__<.))
^^^ % ^^^

[Ext User(Just JT)]

"Noddy" <me@home.com> wrote:
>
> "John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
> news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...
>
>> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.
>
> The rest of us don't owe them jack.
>
~~~~~~~~~~~~
I'm not even white. Why do I owe those freeloaders anything?

--
They.can.work.a.job.like.I.do.

[Ext User(Just JT)]

"RogerM" <RogerM@justrucks.net.au> wrote:
>
>> The rest of us don't owe them jack.
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>> Noddy.
>
> I don't reckon we do either, for the reasons given in the original post.
>
~~~~~~~~~~~~
But the stupid Labor government, which I didn't vote, think we do. It's all
the Labor voters' fault for putting Labor in power!!

--
Hope.Labor.voters.suffer.

[Ext User(Noddy)]

"jackbadger56" <castle56@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:384103bb-6247-4509-a470-

> Step sister calls my step dad every week in tears. She's up in the NT
> as part of the intervention. She's getting paid quite well and I doubt
> saving the world was her first priority. She's emotionally tough (or
> was) yet what she is seeing is breaking her.

What goes on in such places is appalling, but 99% of it is their *own*
doing. If I hadn't seen it myself with my own eyes I wouldn't have beleived
it, and I implore *anyone* who thinks Abbo's are hard done by to take a trip
and get the real story.

> Unfortunately, *every* *single* *incident* regarding abuse she's had to
> deal with in the last
> 4 months has been brought on by alcohol. Biologically, Aboriginals'
> bodies haven't had the 1000's of years to get used to alcohol, they've
> had 200.

I don't buy that :)

No one is born with a genetic tollerance to alcohol, and the "white man's"
ability to deal with the stuff (such as it is) has not been an evolutionary
process. Most abbo's like a drink, and a lot of them like to drink
themselves to oblivion, but then so do a lot of whites, and if you plonked a
bunch of white people who were happy to live in the same kind of environment
into such a settlement and gave them as much free piss as they wanted you'd
be very likely to find that the same problems would exist and Alcohol would
be just as much to blame for them.

> BTW actually I'm not really that passionate about the plight of
> Abbo's, I just hate it when firstly everyone seems to be an expert on
> shit they really don't understand, and secondly I'm sick of politics
> permeating aus.cars to such an extent. I know I should just leave
> these OT posts alone so I shouldn't criticise, but when we're actually
> talking about cars it's a great escape! ;-)

Lol :)

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Ext User(E. Newnes)]

On Fri, 15 Feb 2008 18:31:39 +1100, "Just JT" <Johnnythor@Hotmale.com>
wrote:

>
>"Noddy" <me@home.com> wrote:
>>
>> "John_H" <john4721@inbox.com> wrote in message
>> news:o0t7r3l58d4u9ohl6i1kistfgcgvoqasg9@4ax.com...
>>
>>> The rest of us most certainly owe them apology.
>>
>> The rest of us don't owe them jack.
>>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~
>I'm not even white. Why do I owe those freeloaders anything?

No but you are obviously very ignorant.