grinding on HDD

[Ext User(jb)]

"JAD" <kapasitor@earthcharter.net> wrote in message
news:OIL6g.226$BP4.75@fe07.lga...
>
> "jb" <jbrandonbb@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:z7q4g.4$IY5.0@fe02.lga...
>> I have had this problem for a while now. I have an IDE disk that seems to
>> grind all the time. Anytiem I start programs and such. I am using Google
>> sidebar with a sysmonitor that says the mem is running at about 79-80%. I
>> have 512RAM. teh thing is, I have another PC that seems to work fine on
> 512
>> RAM. This is a Kv8 motherboard with a 2.4GHZ Athlon 64 proc that I built
>> myself. I used to run a SATA disk that failed (I think it is the SATA
>> controller). In other bad news, my Sony DRU-710A CD/DVD drive does not
> come
>> up anymore either. I tried removing the prim and sec controllers in Dev
> Mng
>> but that didn't work. I looked for a driver but there doesn't seem to be
>> one, just a firmware update.
>>
>> Anyway, I did order more RAM, so I will be at 1GB. Do you think I have
>> soemthing else going on besides RAM? Any ideas on getting the CD/DVD
>> back?
>> The computer runs terribly slow most of the time. I use it a lot for
>> recording TV, but I run a lot of defrags.
>>
>> - JB
>>
>>
>
> grinding! actual grinding or an adjective describing a lot of action/work?
> Grinding is not normal whether the PSU RAM MB are failing or not. If the
> 12v/5v rail is is so bad that the drive is grinding, I don't think you
> would
> get a boot. HARD DRIVE FAILURE IS COMING, run the diagnostics from the
> manufacturer IMO.
>
>

Liek is working, there's activity -- but I can hear it making a slight
scratching sound.

[Ext User(jb)]

"Mxsmanic" <mxsmanic@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:t3ln525itganploe6ikdrfvnj1u0vq7i2m@4ax.com...
> jb writes:
>
>> I have had this problem for a while now. I have an IDE disk that seems to
>> grind all the time.
>
> Grind? It makes a funny noise, or what?
>
It is a scratching sound. It's the same sound that happens during a typical
start-up on a working machine as everything is loaded. It only grinds when I
start programs or do other tasks on the computer. But what makes it annoying
is that it happens so much. Starting any program takes a good 10 seconds at
times, but the hd keeps grinindg even for a while after I start using the
program.

[Ext User(jb)]

Thanks, *very helpful. I did many of these things, still grinding.

"Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in message
news:W_P6g.2573$Da5.1338@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
>> It's been like this for a few months. I actually just added another
>> 512 of RAM to see if that helped (1GB total), and it still grinds.
>> So, when I start Outlook for example, it sits there and grinds for
>> maybe 15 seconds
>
> Outlook can take considerably longer to start if corruption occurs.
>
> First thing to do...
> o Backup your data without overwriting any previous backup
>
> Software
> o Spyware, Viruses
> ---- any Net connected PC needs a decent firewall & A/V software
> ---- spyware needs to be run occasionally re malicious code
> o Microsoft Index Service
> ---- disable automatic indexing on all HDs
> o Anti-Virus Configuration
> ---- Norton can scan all office & other I/O for you
> ---- this can massively slow down even high speed PCs
>
> Data Corruption
> o Event logging -- Event Viewer in Win2k/XP
> ---- display filtering -- turn off information, leave on warnings/errors
> ---- look for code 7 -- relating to bad block on HD I/O
> o Data corruption -- Drive Maker Diagnostic Tool
> ---- download the drive makers drive diagnostic utility
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD cold (PC just started)
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD hot (PC has done A/V scan)
>
> Temperatures
> o HD temperature -- HDDTemp drive utility
> ---- download, run, will report the temp of ONE HD on the system
> -------- if you have 2 HDs it may report the cooler vs cooking one :-)
> ---- ensure the HD is ideally <40oC, and most definately <48oC
> -------- if the HD is Maxstor they have a higher temp limit than most
> -------- unfortunately it is met with a higher operating *baseline* :-)
> ---- hot HD temp = relocate in the case or increase intake/exhaust cfm
> -------- HDs dissipate only 12-20W at most, so little CFM is required
> -------- however SOME cfm is required
> o Case temperature -- MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- both temperature zones should report <38oC, ideally ~32oC
> ---- case ambient is the temperature your CPU-cooler & HD-see
> ---- high case ambient = increase exhaust cfm or improve intake area
>
> Memory
> o Usage
> ---- check Commit figures on Task Manager in XP etc
> ---- check swapfile configuration
> o Errors -- MEMTEST utility
> ---- if the machine is stable, memory errors are unlikely
> ---- however it is something to always consider if HD errors found
>
> Cabling
> o Verify HD cables are the correct type & securely fitted
> o SATA non-locking connectors are somewhat unreliable :-)
> o ATA connectors need to be 80-wire
> o Check BIOS settings -- are as expected
> o Check Windows Device Mgr drivers -- are ok, not running in PIO etc
>
> If a HD is on the same bus as an optical device, try splitting onto
> two bus. Errors & problems here would result in other behaviour.
>
> PSU...
> o Verify the PSU voltages if possible
> ---- utilities exist to report - MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- whilst not perfect it would give some hints
> o Verify no capacitors on the mainboard are leaking
> ---- bulging tops, electrolyte emitted around the base
>
> If all ok by this stage it might be worth trying a different PSU.
> o There are only a few PSU manufacturers
> o There are many relabellers & custom specifiers
> o Corner cutting does exist, and can result in instability
>
> If Optical drives dissappear from the BIOS bootup...
> o Verify cabling -- ideally change cables
> ---- particularly if anything uses SATA, bad cables do happen
> o Verify power cabling -- ideally change cables over
> ---- less common bad power cables exist
> o Remove the optical drive -- repeat tests, see if problem persists
> ---- some HDs dislike being master/slave to an optical drive
>
> Filesystem checks...
> o NTFS is more reliable than FAT
>
> Basic housekeeping...
> o Even NTFS suffers from fragmentation of files
> ---- new files overwrite deleted files, or split across available space
> ---- as space gets fragmented so do the files
> o Fragmentation of files involves movement of the head - seeking
> ---- HDs have high areal density for fast data transfer IF zero seeking
> ---- HD head seeking is a very slow electromechanical process
> o Running a disk defragmentation may improve performance
> ---- however you need to know the I/O system is reliable first :-)
>
> You need to pin down whether the problem is Hardware, Software or
> Configuration. Outlook for example can suffer corruption making it
> very slow in opening files - however more severe than you report.
>
> It may be worth checking you have all Office Updates re Outlook...
> o Quite a few bugs in Outlook - indeed some call O/OE a bug
> o office.microsoft.com & update - will download bug fixes
> o Irritatingly XP Windows Update neglects doing office as well
>
> Disk grinding itself can be caused by several things...
> o ECC failure -- actual I/O problems
> ---- creating entry in S.M.A.R.T. data internally & XP Event Viewer
> o Head seeking -- files are severely fragmented
> ---- so the HD is scrambling all over the platters to pick up bits of
> files
> o Temperature -- hot HDs may suffer more thermal recalibration
> ---- this should not normally interrupt seeks, but can if overheating
> o Files themselves -- Lots of folders in outlook can signify trouble
> ---- Outlook & MS-IE create files like gov'ts create pieces of paper
> ---- Outlook folders in particular are individual file packages
> ---- Excessive numbers of folders/files & big archives slow things down
>
> So check if you have a large undeleted folder in Outlook, lots of
> directories, a very large Sent folder, or lots of stored emails. Your
> email dbase is a *.pst file in your Documents area, it will be a hidden
> file. You can backup this file individually, if you delete it then Outlook
> will create a new one, if you move it Outlook will ask for its location.
>
> Windows half the time creates tasks & claims productivity gains by
> trying to do those tasks faster vs not creating them in the first place
> :-)
>
>
> First task is to backup your most important data & verify all readable.
> o It is possible to backup bad data, so avoid overwriting backups
> o A drive may be slow for normal config or fragmentation reasons
> o The machine may be slow due to software configs/miss-configs
>
> XP is a complex muddle, badly written compare to Linux or OS/X.
> It can hide quite malicious spyware, and XPs own Indexing Service
> is superb at dragging a machine to a crawl. Antivirus scanners can
> slow systems down - worst is Norton opening a big Excel file.
>
> A sluggish machine can be improved by using Windows Classic
> and removing all "slow down" options. For example editing the
> registry HKEY to remove the Start / Programs menu delay.
>
> If the drive is Maxstor a) backup immediately b) check temps
> and c) run the manufacturers check. They are less reliable than
> some makes although nothing like IBM Deskstar/Fujitsu probs.
>
> Plenty to check :-)
> --
> Dorothy Bradbury
> www.dorothybradbury.co.uk for NMB-MAT & Panaflo (Panasonic Industrial)
> fans
>

[Ext User(jb)]

"JAD" <kapasitor@earthcharter.net> wrote in message
news:OIL6g.226$BP4.75@fe07.lga...
>
> "jb" <jbrandonbb@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:z7q4g.4$IY5.0@fe02.lga...
>> I have had this problem for a while now. I have an IDE disk that seems to
>> grind all the time. Anytiem I start programs and such. I am using Google
>> sidebar with a sysmonitor that says the mem is running at about 79-80%. I
>> have 512RAM. teh thing is, I have another PC that seems to work fine on
> 512
>> RAM. This is a Kv8 motherboard with a 2.4GHZ Athlon 64 proc that I built
>> myself. I used to run a SATA disk that failed (I think it is the SATA
>> controller). In other bad news, my Sony DRU-710A CD/DVD drive does not
> come
>> up anymore either. I tried removing the prim and sec controllers in Dev
> Mng
>> but that didn't work. I looked for a driver but there doesn't seem to be
>> one, just a firmware update.
>>
>> Anyway, I did order more RAM, so I will be at 1GB. Do you think I have
>> soemthing else going on besides RAM? Any ideas on getting the CD/DVD
>> back?
>> The computer runs terribly slow most of the time. I use it a lot for
>> recording TV, but I run a lot of defrags.
>>
>> - JB
>>
>>
>
> grinding! actual grinding or an adjective describing a lot of action/work?
> Grinding is not normal whether the PSU RAM MB are failing or not. If the
> 12v/5v rail is is so bad that the drive is grinding, I don't think you
> would
> get a boot. HARD DRIVE FAILURE IS COMING, run the diagnostics from the
> manufacturer IMO.
>
>

Liek is working, there's activity -- but I can hear it making a slight
scratching sound.

[Ext User(jb)]

Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file over
about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It doesn't
seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?

- JB

"Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in message
news:W_P6g.2573$Da5.1338@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
>> It's been like this for a few months. I actually just added another
>> 512 of RAM to see if that helped (1GB total), and it still grinds.
>> So, when I start Outlook for example, it sits there and grinds for
>> maybe 15 seconds
>
> Outlook can take considerably longer to start if corruption occurs.
>
> First thing to do...
> o Backup your data without overwriting any previous backup
>
> Software
> o Spyware, Viruses
> ---- any Net connected PC needs a decent firewall & A/V software
> ---- spyware needs to be run occasionally re malicious code
> o Microsoft Index Service
> ---- disable automatic indexing on all HDs
> o Anti-Virus Configuration
> ---- Norton can scan all office & other I/O for you
> ---- this can massively slow down even high speed PCs
>
> Data Corruption
> o Event logging -- Event Viewer in Win2k/XP
> ---- display filtering -- turn off information, leave on warnings/errors
> ---- look for code 7 -- relating to bad block on HD I/O
> o Data corruption -- Drive Maker Diagnostic Tool
> ---- download the drive makers drive diagnostic utility
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD cold (PC just started)
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD hot (PC has done A/V scan)
>
> Temperatures
> o HD temperature -- HDDTemp drive utility
> ---- download, run, will report the temp of ONE HD on the system
> -------- if you have 2 HDs it may report the cooler vs cooking one :-)
> ---- ensure the HD is ideally <40oC, and most definately <48oC
> -------- if the HD is Maxstor they have a higher temp limit than most
> -------- unfortunately it is met with a higher operating *baseline* :-)
> ---- hot HD temp = relocate in the case or increase intake/exhaust cfm
> -------- HDs dissipate only 12-20W at most, so little CFM is required
> -------- however SOME cfm is required
> o Case temperature -- MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- both temperature zones should report <38oC, ideally ~32oC
> ---- case ambient is the temperature your CPU-cooler & HD-see
> ---- high case ambient = increase exhaust cfm or improve intake area
>
> Memory
> o Usage
> ---- check Commit figures on Task Manager in XP etc
> ---- check swapfile configuration
> o Errors -- MEMTEST utility
> ---- if the machine is stable, memory errors are unlikely
> ---- however it is something to always consider if HD errors found
>
> Cabling
> o Verify HD cables are the correct type & securely fitted
> o SATA non-locking connectors are somewhat unreliable :-)
> o ATA connectors need to be 80-wire
> o Check BIOS settings -- are as expected
> o Check Windows Device Mgr drivers -- are ok, not running in PIO etc
>
> If a HD is on the same bus as an optical device, try splitting onto
> two bus. Errors & problems here would result in other behaviour.
>
> PSU...
> o Verify the PSU voltages if possible
> ---- utilities exist to report - MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- whilst not perfect it would give some hints
> o Verify no capacitors on the mainboard are leaking
> ---- bulging tops, electrolyte emitted around the base
>
> If all ok by this stage it might be worth trying a different PSU.
> o There are only a few PSU manufacturers
> o There are many relabellers & custom specifiers
> o Corner cutting does exist, and can result in instability
>
> If Optical drives dissappear from the BIOS bootup...
> o Verify cabling -- ideally change cables
> ---- particularly if anything uses SATA, bad cables do happen
> o Verify power cabling -- ideally change cables over
> ---- less common bad power cables exist
> o Remove the optical drive -- repeat tests, see if problem persists
> ---- some HDs dislike being master/slave to an optical drive
>
> Filesystem checks...
> o NTFS is more reliable than FAT
>
> Basic housekeeping...
> o Even NTFS suffers from fragmentation of files
> ---- new files overwrite deleted files, or split across available space
> ---- as space gets fragmented so do the files
> o Fragmentation of files involves movement of the head - seeking
> ---- HDs have high areal density for fast data transfer IF zero seeking
> ---- HD head seeking is a very slow electromechanical process
> o Running a disk defragmentation may improve performance
> ---- however you need to know the I/O system is reliable first :-)
>
> You need to pin down whether the problem is Hardware, Software or
> Configuration. Outlook for example can suffer corruption making it
> very slow in opening files - however more severe than you report.
>
> It may be worth checking you have all Office Updates re Outlook...
> o Quite a few bugs in Outlook - indeed some call O/OE a bug
> o office.microsoft.com & update - will download bug fixes
> o Irritatingly XP Windows Update neglects doing office as well
>
> Disk grinding itself can be caused by several things...
> o ECC failure -- actual I/O problems
> ---- creating entry in S.M.A.R.T. data internally & XP Event Viewer
> o Head seeking -- files are severely fragmented
> ---- so the HD is scrambling all over the platters to pick up bits of
> files
> o Temperature -- hot HDs may suffer more thermal recalibration
> ---- this should not normally interrupt seeks, but can if overheating
> o Files themselves -- Lots of folders in outlook can signify trouble
> ---- Outlook & MS-IE create files like gov'ts create pieces of paper
> ---- Outlook folders in particular are individual file packages
> ---- Excessive numbers of folders/files & big archives slow things down
>
> So check if you have a large undeleted folder in Outlook, lots of
> directories, a very large Sent folder, or lots of stored emails. Your
> email dbase is a *.pst file in your Documents area, it will be a hidden
> file. You can backup this file individually, if you delete it then Outlook
> will create a new one, if you move it Outlook will ask for its location.
>
> Windows half the time creates tasks & claims productivity gains by
> trying to do those tasks faster vs not creating them in the first place
> :-)
>
>
> First task is to backup your most important data & verify all readable.
> o It is possible to backup bad data, so avoid overwriting backups
> o A drive may be slow for normal config or fragmentation reasons
> o The machine may be slow due to software configs/miss-configs
>
> XP is a complex muddle, badly written compare to Linux or OS/X.
> It can hide quite malicious spyware, and XPs own Indexing Service
> is superb at dragging a machine to a crawl. Antivirus scanners can
> slow systems down - worst is Norton opening a big Excel file.
>
> A sluggish machine can be improved by using Windows Classic
> and removing all "slow down" options. For example editing the
> registry HKEY to remove the Start / Programs menu delay.
>
> If the drive is Maxstor a) backup immediately b) check temps
> and c) run the manufacturers check. They are less reliable than
> some makes although nothing like IBM Deskstar/Fujitsu probs.
>
> Plenty to check :-)
> --
> Dorothy Bradbury
> www.dorothybradbury.co.uk for NMB-MAT & Panaflo (Panasonic Industrial)
> fans
>

[Ext User(jb)]

Thanks, *very helpful. I did many of these things, still grinding.

"Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in message
news:W_P6g.2573$Da5.1338@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
>> It's been like this for a few months. I actually just added another
>> 512 of RAM to see if that helped (1GB total), and it still grinds.
>> So, when I start Outlook for example, it sits there and grinds for
>> maybe 15 seconds
>
> Outlook can take considerably longer to start if corruption occurs.
>
> First thing to do...
> o Backup your data without overwriting any previous backup
>
> Software
> o Spyware, Viruses
> ---- any Net connected PC needs a decent firewall & A/V software
> ---- spyware needs to be run occasionally re malicious code
> o Microsoft Index Service
> ---- disable automatic indexing on all HDs
> o Anti-Virus Configuration
> ---- Norton can scan all office & other I/O for you
> ---- this can massively slow down even high speed PCs
>
> Data Corruption
> o Event logging -- Event Viewer in Win2k/XP
> ---- display filtering -- turn off information, leave on warnings/errors
> ---- look for code 7 -- relating to bad block on HD I/O
> o Data corruption -- Drive Maker Diagnostic Tool
> ---- download the drive makers drive diagnostic utility
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD cold (PC just started)
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD hot (PC has done A/V scan)
>
> Temperatures
> o HD temperature -- HDDTemp drive utility
> ---- download, run, will report the temp of ONE HD on the system
> -------- if you have 2 HDs it may report the cooler vs cooking one :-)
> ---- ensure the HD is ideally <40oC, and most definately <48oC
> -------- if the HD is Maxstor they have a higher temp limit than most
> -------- unfortunately it is met with a higher operating *baseline* :-)
> ---- hot HD temp = relocate in the case or increase intake/exhaust cfm
> -------- HDs dissipate only 12-20W at most, so little CFM is required
> -------- however SOME cfm is required
> o Case temperature -- MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- both temperature zones should report <38oC, ideally ~32oC
> ---- case ambient is the temperature your CPU-cooler & HD-see
> ---- high case ambient = increase exhaust cfm or improve intake area
>
> Memory
> o Usage
> ---- check Commit figures on Task Manager in XP etc
> ---- check swapfile configuration
> o Errors -- MEMTEST utility
> ---- if the machine is stable, memory errors are unlikely
> ---- however it is something to always consider if HD errors found
>
> Cabling
> o Verify HD cables are the correct type & securely fitted
> o SATA non-locking connectors are somewhat unreliable :-)
> o ATA connectors need to be 80-wire
> o Check BIOS settings -- are as expected
> o Check Windows Device Mgr drivers -- are ok, not running in PIO etc
>
> If a HD is on the same bus as an optical device, try splitting onto
> two bus. Errors & problems here would result in other behaviour.
>
> PSU...
> o Verify the PSU voltages if possible
> ---- utilities exist to report - MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- whilst not perfect it would give some hints
> o Verify no capacitors on the mainboard are leaking
> ---- bulging tops, electrolyte emitted around the base
>
> If all ok by this stage it might be worth trying a different PSU.
> o There are only a few PSU manufacturers
> o There are many relabellers & custom specifiers
> o Corner cutting does exist, and can result in instability
>
> If Optical drives dissappear from the BIOS bootup...
> o Verify cabling -- ideally change cables
> ---- particularly if anything uses SATA, bad cables do happen
> o Verify power cabling -- ideally change cables over
> ---- less common bad power cables exist
> o Remove the optical drive -- repeat tests, see if problem persists
> ---- some HDs dislike being master/slave to an optical drive
>
> Filesystem checks...
> o NTFS is more reliable than FAT
>
> Basic housekeeping...
> o Even NTFS suffers from fragmentation of files
> ---- new files overwrite deleted files, or split across available space
> ---- as space gets fragmented so do the files
> o Fragmentation of files involves movement of the head - seeking
> ---- HDs have high areal density for fast data transfer IF zero seeking
> ---- HD head seeking is a very slow electromechanical process
> o Running a disk defragmentation may improve performance
> ---- however you need to know the I/O system is reliable first :-)
>
> You need to pin down whether the problem is Hardware, Software or
> Configuration. Outlook for example can suffer corruption making it
> very slow in opening files - however more severe than you report.
>
> It may be worth checking you have all Office Updates re Outlook...
> o Quite a few bugs in Outlook - indeed some call O/OE a bug
> o office.microsoft.com & update - will download bug fixes
> o Irritatingly XP Windows Update neglects doing office as well
>
> Disk grinding itself can be caused by several things...
> o ECC failure -- actual I/O problems
> ---- creating entry in S.M.A.R.T. data internally & XP Event Viewer
> o Head seeking -- files are severely fragmented
> ---- so the HD is scrambling all over the platters to pick up bits of
> files
> o Temperature -- hot HDs may suffer more thermal recalibration
> ---- this should not normally interrupt seeks, but can if overheating
> o Files themselves -- Lots of folders in outlook can signify trouble
> ---- Outlook & MS-IE create files like gov'ts create pieces of paper
> ---- Outlook folders in particular are individual file packages
> ---- Excessive numbers of folders/files & big archives slow things down
>
> So check if you have a large undeleted folder in Outlook, lots of
> directories, a very large Sent folder, or lots of stored emails. Your
> email dbase is a *.pst file in your Documents area, it will be a hidden
> file. You can backup this file individually, if you delete it then Outlook
> will create a new one, if you move it Outlook will ask for its location.
>
> Windows half the time creates tasks & claims productivity gains by
> trying to do those tasks faster vs not creating them in the first place
> :-)
>
>
> First task is to backup your most important data & verify all readable.
> o It is possible to backup bad data, so avoid overwriting backups
> o A drive may be slow for normal config or fragmentation reasons
> o The machine may be slow due to software configs/miss-configs
>
> XP is a complex muddle, badly written compare to Linux or OS/X.
> It can hide quite malicious spyware, and XPs own Indexing Service
> is superb at dragging a machine to a crawl. Antivirus scanners can
> slow systems down - worst is Norton opening a big Excel file.
>
> A sluggish machine can be improved by using Windows Classic
> and removing all "slow down" options. For example editing the
> registry HKEY to remove the Start / Programs menu delay.
>
> If the drive is Maxstor a) backup immediately b) check temps
> and c) run the manufacturers check. They are less reliable than
> some makes although nothing like IBM Deskstar/Fujitsu probs.
>
> Plenty to check :-)
> --
> Dorothy Bradbury
> www.dorothybradbury.co.uk for NMB-MAT & Panaflo (Panasonic Industrial)
> fans
>

[Ext User(JAD)]

"jb" <jbrandonbbremove@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:h_U6g.1712$R03.255@fe03.lga...
> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
over
> about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It doesn't
> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?


do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in disk
management?
virtual memory settings?
scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
anti virus running a test behind the scene?



>
> - JB
>
> "Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in
message
> news:W_P6g.2573$Da5.1338@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
> >> It's been like this for a few months. I actually just added another
> >> 512 of RAM to see if that helped (1GB total), and it still grinds.
> >> So, when I start Outlook for example, it sits there and grinds for
> >> maybe 15 seconds
> >
> > Outlook can take considerably longer to start if corruption occurs.
> >
> > First thing to do...
> > o Backup your data without overwriting any previous backup
> >
> > Software
> > o Spyware, Viruses
> > ---- any Net connected PC needs a decent firewall & A/V software
> > ---- spyware needs to be run occasionally re malicious code
> > o Microsoft Index Service
> > ---- disable automatic indexing on all HDs
> > o Anti-Virus Configuration
> > ---- Norton can scan all office & other I/O for you
> > ---- this can massively slow down even high speed PCs
> >
> > Data Corruption
> > o Event logging -- Event Viewer in Win2k/XP
> > ---- display filtering -- turn off information, leave on warnings/errors
> > ---- look for code 7 -- relating to bad block on HD I/O
> > o Data corruption -- Drive Maker Diagnostic Tool
> > ---- download the drive makers drive diagnostic utility
> > ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD cold (PC just started)
> > ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD hot (PC has done A/V
scan)
> >
> > Temperatures
> > o HD temperature -- HDDTemp drive utility
> > ---- download, run, will report the temp of ONE HD on the system
> > -------- if you have 2 HDs it may report the cooler vs cooking one :-)
> > ---- ensure the HD is ideally <40oC, and most definately <48oC
> > -------- if the HD is Maxstor they have a higher temp limit than most
> > -------- unfortunately it is met with a higher operating *baseline* :-)
> > ---- hot HD temp = relocate in the case or increase intake/exhaust cfm
> > -------- HDs dissipate only 12-20W at most, so little CFM is required
> > -------- however SOME cfm is required
> > o Case temperature -- MBM or m/b maker utility
> > ---- both temperature zones should report <38oC, ideally ~32oC
> > ---- case ambient is the temperature your CPU-cooler & HD-see
> > ---- high case ambient = increase exhaust cfm or improve intake area
> >
> > Memory
> > o Usage
> > ---- check Commit figures on Task Manager in XP etc
> > ---- check swapfile configuration
> > o Errors -- MEMTEST utility
> > ---- if the machine is stable, memory errors are unlikely
> > ---- however it is something to always consider if HD errors found
> >
> > Cabling
> > o Verify HD cables are the correct type & securely fitted
> > o SATA non-locking connectors are somewhat unreliable :-)
> > o ATA connectors need to be 80-wire
> > o Check BIOS settings -- are as expected
> > o Check Windows Device Mgr drivers -- are ok, not running in PIO etc
> >
> > If a HD is on the same bus as an optical device, try splitting onto
> > two bus. Errors & problems here would result in other behaviour.
> >
> > PSU...
> > o Verify the PSU voltages if possible
> > ---- utilities exist to report - MBM or m/b maker utility
> > ---- whilst not perfect it would give some hints
> > o Verify no capacitors on the mainboard are leaking
> > ---- bulging tops, electrolyte emitted around the base
> >
> > If all ok by this stage it might be worth trying a different PSU.
> > o There are only a few PSU manufacturers
> > o There are many relabellers & custom specifiers
> > o Corner cutting does exist, and can result in instability
> >
> > If Optical drives dissappear from the BIOS bootup...
> > o Verify cabling -- ideally change cables
> > ---- particularly if anything uses SATA, bad cables do happen
> > o Verify power cabling -- ideally change cables over
> > ---- less common bad power cables exist
> > o Remove the optical drive -- repeat tests, see if problem persists
> > ---- some HDs dislike being master/slave to an optical drive
> >
> > Filesystem checks...
> > o NTFS is more reliable than FAT
> >
> > Basic housekeeping...
> > o Even NTFS suffers from fragmentation of files
> > ---- new files overwrite deleted files, or split across available space
> > ---- as space gets fragmented so do the files
> > o Fragmentation of files involves movement of the head - seeking
> > ---- HDs have high areal density for fast data transfer IF zero seeking
> > ---- HD head seeking is a very slow electromechanical process
> > o Running a disk defragmentation may improve performance
> > ---- however you need to know the I/O system is reliable first :-)
> >
> > You need to pin down whether the problem is Hardware, Software or
> > Configuration. Outlook for example can suffer corruption making it
> > very slow in opening files - however more severe than you report.
> >
> > It may be worth checking you have all Office Updates re Outlook...
> > o Quite a few bugs in Outlook - indeed some call O/OE a bug
> > o office.microsoft.com & update - will download bug fixes
> > o Irritatingly XP Windows Update neglects doing office as well
> >
> > Disk grinding itself can be caused by several things...
> > o ECC failure -- actual I/O problems
> > ---- creating entry in S.M.A.R.T. data internally & XP Event Viewer
> > o Head seeking -- files are severely fragmented
> > ---- so the HD is scrambling all over the platters to pick up bits of
> > files
> > o Temperature -- hot HDs may suffer more thermal recalibration
> > ---- this should not normally interrupt seeks, but can if overheating
> > o Files themselves -- Lots of folders in outlook can signify trouble
> > ---- Outlook & MS-IE create files like gov'ts create pieces of paper
> > ---- Outlook folders in particular are individual file packages
> > ---- Excessive numbers of folders/files & big archives slow things down
> >
> > So check if you have a large undeleted folder in Outlook, lots of
> > directories, a very large Sent folder, or lots of stored emails. Your
> > email dbase is a *.pst file in your Documents area, it will be a hidden
> > file. You can backup this file individually, if you delete it then
Outlook
> > will create a new one, if you move it Outlook will ask for its location.
> >
> > Windows half the time creates tasks & claims productivity gains by
> > trying to do those tasks faster vs not creating them in the first place
> > :-)
> >
> >
> > First task is to backup your most important data & verify all readable.
> > o It is possible to backup bad data, so avoid overwriting backups
> > o A drive may be slow for normal config or fragmentation reasons
> > o The machine may be slow due to software configs/miss-configs
> >
> > XP is a complex muddle, badly written compare to Linux or OS/X.
> > It can hide quite malicious spyware, and XPs own Indexing Service
> > is superb at dragging a machine to a crawl. Antivirus scanners can
> > slow systems down - worst is Norton opening a big Excel file.
> >
> > A sluggish machine can be improved by using Windows Classic
> > and removing all "slow down" options. For example editing the
> > registry HKEY to remove the Start / Programs menu delay.
> >
> > If the drive is Maxstor a) backup immediately b) check temps
> > and c) run the manufacturers check. They are less reliable than
> > some makes although nothing like IBM Deskstar/Fujitsu probs.
> >
> > Plenty to check :-)
> > --
> > Dorothy Bradbury
> > www.dorothybradbury.co.uk for NMB-MAT & Panaflo (Panasonic Industrial)
> > fans
> >
>
>

[Ext User(jb)]

Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file over
about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It doesn't
seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?

- JB

"Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in message
news:W_P6g.2573$Da5.1338@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
>> It's been like this for a few months. I actually just added another
>> 512 of RAM to see if that helped (1GB total), and it still grinds.
>> So, when I start Outlook for example, it sits there and grinds for
>> maybe 15 seconds
>
> Outlook can take considerably longer to start if corruption occurs.
>
> First thing to do...
> o Backup your data without overwriting any previous backup
>
> Software
> o Spyware, Viruses
> ---- any Net connected PC needs a decent firewall & A/V software
> ---- spyware needs to be run occasionally re malicious code
> o Microsoft Index Service
> ---- disable automatic indexing on all HDs
> o Anti-Virus Configuration
> ---- Norton can scan all office & other I/O for you
> ---- this can massively slow down even high speed PCs
>
> Data Corruption
> o Event logging -- Event Viewer in Win2k/XP
> ---- display filtering -- turn off information, leave on warnings/errors
> ---- look for code 7 -- relating to bad block on HD I/O
> o Data corruption -- Drive Maker Diagnostic Tool
> ---- download the drive makers drive diagnostic utility
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD cold (PC just started)
> ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD hot (PC has done A/V scan)
>
> Temperatures
> o HD temperature -- HDDTemp drive utility
> ---- download, run, will report the temp of ONE HD on the system
> -------- if you have 2 HDs it may report the cooler vs cooking one :-)
> ---- ensure the HD is ideally <40oC, and most definately <48oC
> -------- if the HD is Maxstor they have a higher temp limit than most
> -------- unfortunately it is met with a higher operating *baseline* :-)
> ---- hot HD temp = relocate in the case or increase intake/exhaust cfm
> -------- HDs dissipate only 12-20W at most, so little CFM is required
> -------- however SOME cfm is required
> o Case temperature -- MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- both temperature zones should report <38oC, ideally ~32oC
> ---- case ambient is the temperature your CPU-cooler & HD-see
> ---- high case ambient = increase exhaust cfm or improve intake area
>
> Memory
> o Usage
> ---- check Commit figures on Task Manager in XP etc
> ---- check swapfile configuration
> o Errors -- MEMTEST utility
> ---- if the machine is stable, memory errors are unlikely
> ---- however it is something to always consider if HD errors found
>
> Cabling
> o Verify HD cables are the correct type & securely fitted
> o SATA non-locking connectors are somewhat unreliable :-)
> o ATA connectors need to be 80-wire
> o Check BIOS settings -- are as expected
> o Check Windows Device Mgr drivers -- are ok, not running in PIO etc
>
> If a HD is on the same bus as an optical device, try splitting onto
> two bus. Errors & problems here would result in other behaviour.
>
> PSU...
> o Verify the PSU voltages if possible
> ---- utilities exist to report - MBM or m/b maker utility
> ---- whilst not perfect it would give some hints
> o Verify no capacitors on the mainboard are leaking
> ---- bulging tops, electrolyte emitted around the base
>
> If all ok by this stage it might be worth trying a different PSU.
> o There are only a few PSU manufacturers
> o There are many relabellers & custom specifiers
> o Corner cutting does exist, and can result in instability
>
> If Optical drives dissappear from the BIOS bootup...
> o Verify cabling -- ideally change cables
> ---- particularly if anything uses SATA, bad cables do happen
> o Verify power cabling -- ideally change cables over
> ---- less common bad power cables exist
> o Remove the optical drive -- repeat tests, see if problem persists
> ---- some HDs dislike being master/slave to an optical drive
>
> Filesystem checks...
> o NTFS is more reliable than FAT
>
> Basic housekeeping...
> o Even NTFS suffers from fragmentation of files
> ---- new files overwrite deleted files, or split across available space
> ---- as space gets fragmented so do the files
> o Fragmentation of files involves movement of the head - seeking
> ---- HDs have high areal density for fast data transfer IF zero seeking
> ---- HD head seeking is a very slow electromechanical process
> o Running a disk defragmentation may improve performance
> ---- however you need to know the I/O system is reliable first :-)
>
> You need to pin down whether the problem is Hardware, Software or
> Configuration. Outlook for example can suffer corruption making it
> very slow in opening files - however more severe than you report.
>
> It may be worth checking you have all Office Updates re Outlook...
> o Quite a few bugs in Outlook - indeed some call O/OE a bug
> o office.microsoft.com & update - will download bug fixes
> o Irritatingly XP Windows Update neglects doing office as well
>
> Disk grinding itself can be caused by several things...
> o ECC failure -- actual I/O problems
> ---- creating entry in S.M.A.R.T. data internally & XP Event Viewer
> o Head seeking -- files are severely fragmented
> ---- so the HD is scrambling all over the platters to pick up bits of
> files
> o Temperature -- hot HDs may suffer more thermal recalibration
> ---- this should not normally interrupt seeks, but can if overheating
> o Files themselves -- Lots of folders in outlook can signify trouble
> ---- Outlook & MS-IE create files like gov'ts create pieces of paper
> ---- Outlook folders in particular are individual file packages
> ---- Excessive numbers of folders/files & big archives slow things down
>
> So check if you have a large undeleted folder in Outlook, lots of
> directories, a very large Sent folder, or lots of stored emails. Your
> email dbase is a *.pst file in your Documents area, it will be a hidden
> file. You can backup this file individually, if you delete it then Outlook
> will create a new one, if you move it Outlook will ask for its location.
>
> Windows half the time creates tasks & claims productivity gains by
> trying to do those tasks faster vs not creating them in the first place
> :-)
>
>
> First task is to backup your most important data & verify all readable.
> o It is possible to backup bad data, so avoid overwriting backups
> o A drive may be slow for normal config or fragmentation reasons
> o The machine may be slow due to software configs/miss-configs
>
> XP is a complex muddle, badly written compare to Linux or OS/X.
> It can hide quite malicious spyware, and XPs own Indexing Service
> is superb at dragging a machine to a crawl. Antivirus scanners can
> slow systems down - worst is Norton opening a big Excel file.
>
> A sluggish machine can be improved by using Windows Classic
> and removing all "slow down" options. For example editing the
> registry HKEY to remove the Start / Programs menu delay.
>
> If the drive is Maxstor a) backup immediately b) check temps
> and c) run the manufacturers check. They are less reliable than
> some makes although nothing like IBM Deskstar/Fujitsu probs.
>
> Plenty to check :-)
> --
> Dorothy Bradbury
> www.dorothybradbury.co.uk for NMB-MAT & Panaflo (Panasonic Industrial)
> fans
>

[Ext User(JAD)]

"jb" <jbrandonbbremove@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:h_U6g.1712$R03.255@fe03.lga...
> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
over
> about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It doesn't
> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?


do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in disk
management?
virtual memory settings?
scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
anti virus running a test behind the scene?



>
> - JB
>
> "Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in
message
> news:W_P6g.2573$Da5.1338@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
> >> It's been like this for a few months. I actually just added another
> >> 512 of RAM to see if that helped (1GB total), and it still grinds.
> >> So, when I start Outlook for example, it sits there and grinds for
> >> maybe 15 seconds
> >
> > Outlook can take considerably longer to start if corruption occurs.
> >
> > First thing to do...
> > o Backup your data without overwriting any previous backup
> >
> > Software
> > o Spyware, Viruses
> > ---- any Net connected PC needs a decent firewall & A/V software
> > ---- spyware needs to be run occasionally re malicious code
> > o Microsoft Index Service
> > ---- disable automatic indexing on all HDs
> > o Anti-Virus Configuration
> > ---- Norton can scan all office & other I/O for you
> > ---- this can massively slow down even high speed PCs
> >
> > Data Corruption
> > o Event logging -- Event Viewer in Win2k/XP
> > ---- display filtering -- turn off information, leave on warnings/errors
> > ---- look for code 7 -- relating to bad block on HD I/O
> > o Data corruption -- Drive Maker Diagnostic Tool
> > ---- download the drive makers drive diagnostic utility
> > ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD cold (PC just started)
> > ---- verify the drive passes all tests with HD hot (PC has done A/V
scan)
> >
> > Temperatures
> > o HD temperature -- HDDTemp drive utility
> > ---- download, run, will report the temp of ONE HD on the system
> > -------- if you have 2 HDs it may report the cooler vs cooking one :-)
> > ---- ensure the HD is ideally <40oC, and most definately <48oC
> > -------- if the HD is Maxstor they have a higher temp limit than most
> > -------- unfortunately it is met with a higher operating *baseline* :-)
> > ---- hot HD temp = relocate in the case or increase intake/exhaust cfm
> > -------- HDs dissipate only 12-20W at most, so little CFM is required
> > -------- however SOME cfm is required
> > o Case temperature -- MBM or m/b maker utility
> > ---- both temperature zones should report <38oC, ideally ~32oC
> > ---- case ambient is the temperature your CPU-cooler & HD-see
> > ---- high case ambient = increase exhaust cfm or improve intake area
> >
> > Memory
> > o Usage
> > ---- check Commit figures on Task Manager in XP etc
> > ---- check swapfile configuration
> > o Errors -- MEMTEST utility
> > ---- if the machine is stable, memory errors are unlikely
> > ---- however it is something to always consider if HD errors found
> >
> > Cabling
> > o Verify HD cables are the correct type & securely fitted
> > o SATA non-locking connectors are somewhat unreliable :-)
> > o ATA connectors need to be 80-wire
> > o Check BIOS settings -- are as expected
> > o Check Windows Device Mgr drivers -- are ok, not running in PIO etc
> >
> > If a HD is on the same bus as an optical device, try splitting onto
> > two bus. Errors & problems here would result in other behaviour.
> >
> > PSU...
> > o Verify the PSU voltages if possible
> > ---- utilities exist to report - MBM or m/b maker utility
> > ---- whilst not perfect it would give some hints
> > o Verify no capacitors on the mainboard are leaking
> > ---- bulging tops, electrolyte emitted around the base
> >
> > If all ok by this stage it might be worth trying a different PSU.
> > o There are only a few PSU manufacturers
> > o There are many relabellers & custom specifiers
> > o Corner cutting does exist, and can result in instability
> >
> > If Optical drives dissappear from the BIOS bootup...
> > o Verify cabling -- ideally change cables
> > ---- particularly if anything uses SATA, bad cables do happen
> > o Verify power cabling -- ideally change cables over
> > ---- less common bad power cables exist
> > o Remove the optical drive -- repeat tests, see if problem persists
> > ---- some HDs dislike being master/slave to an optical drive
> >
> > Filesystem checks...
> > o NTFS is more reliable than FAT
> >
> > Basic housekeeping...
> > o Even NTFS suffers from fragmentation of files
> > ---- new files overwrite deleted files, or split across available space
> > ---- as space gets fragmented so do the files
> > o Fragmentation of files involves movement of the head - seeking
> > ---- HDs have high areal density for fast data transfer IF zero seeking
> > ---- HD head seeking is a very slow electromechanical process
> > o Running a disk defragmentation may improve performance
> > ---- however you need to know the I/O system is reliable first :-)
> >
> > You need to pin down whether the problem is Hardware, Software or
> > Configuration. Outlook for example can suffer corruption making it
> > very slow in opening files - however more severe than you report.
> >
> > It may be worth checking you have all Office Updates re Outlook...
> > o Quite a few bugs in Outlook - indeed some call O/OE a bug
> > o office.microsoft.com & update - will download bug fixes
> > o Irritatingly XP Windows Update neglects doing office as well
> >
> > Disk grinding itself can be caused by several things...
> > o ECC failure -- actual I/O problems
> > ---- creating entry in S.M.A.R.T. data internally & XP Event Viewer
> > o Head seeking -- files are severely fragmented
> > ---- so the HD is scrambling all over the platters to pick up bits of
> > files
> > o Temperature -- hot HDs may suffer more thermal recalibration
> > ---- this should not normally interrupt seeks, but can if overheating
> > o Files themselves -- Lots of folders in outlook can signify trouble
> > ---- Outlook & MS-IE create files like gov'ts create pieces of paper
> > ---- Outlook folders in particular are individual file packages
> > ---- Excessive numbers of folders/files & big archives slow things down
> >
> > So check if you have a large undeleted folder in Outlook, lots of
> > directories, a very large Sent folder, or lots of stored emails. Your
> > email dbase is a *.pst file in your Documents area, it will be a hidden
> > file. You can backup this file individually, if you delete it then
Outlook
> > will create a new one, if you move it Outlook will ask for its location.
> >
> > Windows half the time creates tasks & claims productivity gains by
> > trying to do those tasks faster vs not creating them in the first place
> > :-)
> >
> >
> > First task is to backup your most important data & verify all readable.
> > o It is possible to backup bad data, so avoid overwriting backups
> > o A drive may be slow for normal config or fragmentation reasons
> > o The machine may be slow due to software configs/miss-configs
> >
> > XP is a complex muddle, badly written compare to Linux or OS/X.
> > It can hide quite malicious spyware, and XPs own Indexing Service
> > is superb at dragging a machine to a crawl. Antivirus scanners can
> > slow systems down - worst is Norton opening a big Excel file.
> >
> > A sluggish machine can be improved by using Windows Classic
> > and removing all "slow down" options. For example editing the
> > registry HKEY to remove the Start / Programs menu delay.
> >
> > If the drive is Maxstor a) backup immediately b) check temps
> > and c) run the manufacturers check. They are less reliable than
> > some makes although nothing like IBM Deskstar/Fujitsu probs.
> >
> > Plenty to check :-)
> > --
> > Dorothy Bradbury
> > www.dorothybradbury.co.uk for NMB-MAT & Panaflo (Panasonic Industrial)
> > fans
> >
>
>

[Ext User(Mxsmanic)]

jb writes:

> Liek is working, there's activity -- but I can hear it making a slight
> scratching sound.

If it has always made this sound but has worked for a long time, it's
probably okay. If it is new and making an odd sound, it may be
defective. If it has never made the sound before and makes it now,
something may be wearing or breaking/broken in the drive.

In this last case, it's prudent to assume that failure is near,
although it is worth noting that drives can make odd noises for years
without ever actually failing. The sounds usually come from worn
bearings, and sometimes bearings can be noisy long before they
actually fail. Nevertheless, it's best to assume that failure might
be forthcoming and plan accordingly.

You can use S.M.A.R.T. test programs to examine the state of the
drive, also.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Ext User(Mxsmanic)]

jb writes:

> Liek is working, there's activity -- but I can hear it making a slight
> scratching sound.

If it has always made this sound but has worked for a long time, it's
probably okay. If it is new and making an odd sound, it may be
defective. If it has never made the sound before and makes it now,
something may be wearing or breaking/broken in the drive.

In this last case, it's prudent to assume that failure is near,
although it is worth noting that drives can make odd noises for years
without ever actually failing. The sounds usually come from worn
bearings, and sometimes bearings can be noisy long before they
actually fail. Nevertheless, it's best to assume that failure might
be forthcoming and plan accordingly.

You can use S.M.A.R.T. test programs to examine the state of the
drive, also.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Ext User(Mxsmanic)]

jb writes:

> It is a scratching sound. It's the same sound that happens during a typical
> start-up on a working machine as everything is loaded. It only grinds when I
> start programs or do other tasks on the computer. But what makes it annoying
> is that it happens so much. Starting any program takes a good 10 seconds at
> times, but the hd keeps grinindg even for a while after I start using the
> program.

On modern Windows desktops, the disk is active a great deal; it isn't
as noticeable as it used to be because disks aren't as noisy as they
used to be (especially when seeking). It's unlikely that anything is
actually scratching the disk, as any physical contact with the disk
would cause an immediate head crash. There may be something touching
the actuator or some noise in the actuator, which may or may not be a
sign of an impending problem.

If programs start much more slowly than they used to, the disk may be
struggling with attempts to read and reread (or write and rewrite)
defective disk areas. If this is the case, the disk will eventually
fail.

It can't hurt to run S.M.A.R.T. tests against the drive to see if it
actually has logged errors and/or can tolerate a test suite.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Ext User(Mxsmanic)]

jb writes:

> It is a scratching sound. It's the same sound that happens during a typical
> start-up on a working machine as everything is loaded. It only grinds when I
> start programs or do other tasks on the computer. But what makes it annoying
> is that it happens so much. Starting any program takes a good 10 seconds at
> times, but the hd keeps grinindg even for a while after I start using the
> program.

On modern Windows desktops, the disk is active a great deal; it isn't
as noticeable as it used to be because disks aren't as noisy as they
used to be (especially when seeking). It's unlikely that anything is
actually scratching the disk, as any physical contact with the disk
would cause an immediate head crash. There may be something touching
the actuator or some noise in the actuator, which may or may not be a
sign of an impending problem.

If programs start much more slowly than they used to, the disk may be
struggling with attempts to read and reread (or write and rewrite)
defective disk areas. If this is the case, the disk will eventually
fail.

It can't hurt to run S.M.A.R.T. tests against the drive to see if it
actually has logged errors and/or can tolerate a test suite.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Ext User(Dorothy Bradbury)]

>> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
>> over about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It
>> doesn't
>> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?
>
> do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in
> disk
> management?
> virtual memory settings?
> scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
> anti virus running a test behind the scene?

Multiple small files tends to drive indexers mad (I had 700,000 at one
stage and when Norton met that things took a very long time to complete).

Something is running in the background, he needs to find just what.

Indexer is my bet if the HD passes diagnostics ok.
There are smart (& pricey) indexers out there, better than MSFTs, but
the MSFT one can really drag a system down as it goes about its work.
--
DB.

[Ext User(Dorothy Bradbury)]

>> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
>> over about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It
>> doesn't
>> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?
>
> do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in
> disk
> management?
> virtual memory settings?
> scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
> anti virus running a test behind the scene?

Multiple small files tends to drive indexers mad (I had 700,000 at one
stage and when Norton met that things took a very long time to complete).

Something is running in the background, he needs to find just what.

Indexer is my bet if the HD passes diagnostics ok.
There are smart (& pricey) indexers out there, better than MSFTs, but
the MSFT one can really drag a system down as it goes about its work.
--
DB.

[Ext User(Mxsmanic)]

Dorothy Bradbury writes:

> Multiple small files tends to drive indexers mad (I had 700,000 at one
> stage and when Norton met that things took a very long time to complete).
>
> Something is running in the background, he needs to find just what.
>
> Indexer is my bet if the HD passes diagnostics ok.
> There are smart (& pricey) indexers out there, better than MSFTs, but
> the MSFT one can really drag a system down as it goes about its work.

I always turn indexing off. It's a lot cheaper to just search the
file system when I try to find something than to build expensive and
bulky indexes in advance.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Ext User(Mxsmanic)]

Dorothy Bradbury writes:

> Multiple small files tends to drive indexers mad (I had 700,000 at one
> stage and when Norton met that things took a very long time to complete).
>
> Something is running in the background, he needs to find just what.
>
> Indexer is my bet if the HD passes diagnostics ok.
> There are smart (& pricey) indexers out there, better than MSFTs, but
> the MSFT one can really drag a system down as it goes about its work.

I always turn indexing off. It's a lot cheaper to just search the
file system when I try to find something than to build expensive and
bulky indexes in advance.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

[Ext User(jb)]

"Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1C%6g.52$oh3.34@newsfe5-gui.ntli.net...
>>> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
>>> over about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It
>>> doesn't
>>> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?
>>
>> do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in
>> disk
>> management?
>> virtual memory settings?
>> scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
>> anti virus running a test behind the scene?
>
> Multiple small files tends to drive indexers mad (I had 700,000 at one
> stage and when Norton met that things took a very long time to complete).
>
> Something is running in the background, he needs to find just what.
>
> Indexer is my bet if the HD passes diagnostics ok.
> There are smart (& pricey) indexers out there, better than MSFTs, but
> the MSFT one can really drag a system down as it goes about its work.
> --


I had Google Desktop, but I removed it yesterday. Programs still scratch for
a while on the disk when they start, but not as much. So that means the
problem is going away right? I mean, I know they should scratch some, but I
just compare this to my laptop where programs just snap open.

It's not really an issue of speed (eventually programs seem to run okay), or
even needing to keep the disk from crashing (I keep all my data on an
external network drive). In fact, at this point it is just more an issue
that's annoying me that I can't figure it out, and that if the disk fails I
may be rebuilding the system, which I don't want to do.

- JB

[Ext User(jb)]

"Dorothy Bradbury" <dorothybradbury@dorothybradbury.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1C%6g.52$oh3.34@newsfe5-gui.ntli.net...
>>> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
>>> over about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It
>>> doesn't
>>> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?
>>
>> do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in
>> disk
>> management?
>> virtual memory settings?
>> scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
>> anti virus running a test behind the scene?
>
> Multiple small files tends to drive indexers mad (I had 700,000 at one
> stage and when Norton met that things took a very long time to complete).
>
> Something is running in the background, he needs to find just what.
>
> Indexer is my bet if the HD passes diagnostics ok.
> There are smart (& pricey) indexers out there, better than MSFTs, but
> the MSFT one can really drag a system down as it goes about its work.
> --


I had Google Desktop, but I removed it yesterday. Programs still scratch for
a while on the disk when they start, but not as much. So that means the
problem is going away right? I mean, I know they should scratch some, but I
just compare this to my laptop where programs just snap open.

It's not really an issue of speed (eventually programs seem to run okay), or
even needing to keep the disk from crashing (I keep all my data on an
external network drive). In fact, at this point it is just more an issue
that's annoying me that I can't figure it out, and that if the disk fails I
may be rebuilding the system, which I don't want to do.

- JB

[Ext User(jb)]

"JAD" <kapasitor@earthcharter.net> wrote in message
news:tIV6g.503$zz.347@fe05.lga...
>
> "jb" <jbrandonbbremove@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:h_U6g.1712$R03.255@fe03.lga...
>> Actually, it might be grinding less now. What I did is moved every file
> over
>> about 100MB (I have lots of video files) to an external disk. It doesn't
>> seem to beat on the disk *as much, but could that really have been it?
>
>
> do you have media sniffers or indexing enabled in an office suite on in
> disk
> management?
> virtual memory settings?
> scratch disk setup from a graphics program?
> anti virus running a test behind the scene?

Where do I find the indexing for Office? I removed Google Desktop. I don't
have a media sniffer. VM is at a system managed size with 160GB free.
Graphics programs are not running -- this is mainly OUtlook, FireFox,
Outlook Express, Word, and games. No virus checker running.

When you say "in disk management" what does that mean?