OT: whipper snipper motor seized?

[Ben Thomas]

Hi all,

I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I thought was a
correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according to the instructions)
but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't restart. It actually seems
jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.

I took out the spark plug and the white ceramic part has a black sooty coating.

I wasn't running it flat out (but probably close to it) or trying to cut through
heavy grass or fence posts, etc.

Any ideas?

--
Ben Thomas - Software Engineer - Melbourne, Australia
2001 manual 2.2l Holden Astra SRi - a real pleasure to drive;
Michelin Preceda - $250 each but last a lot longer than $200 tyres;
Alpine Type S speakers and amp, JVC MP3 CD playing head-unit.

Opinions, conclusions, and other information in this message that do not
relate to the official business of my employer shall be understood as neither
given nor endorsed by it.

[Nige]

"Ben Thomas" <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote in message
news:4nivrc.adq.ln@192.168.11.2...
> Hi all,
>
> I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I thought
was a
> correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according to the
instructions)
> but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't restart. It actually
seems
> jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.
>
> I took out the spark plug and the white ceramic part has a black sooty
coating.

sounds like you've flooded it rather than seized it (actually running way to
rich). The black sooty stuff would have been white if you were running to
lean.

>
> I wasn't running it flat out (but probably close to it) or trying to cut
through
> heavy grass or fence posts, etc.
>
> Any ideas?
>

let it cool, clean the plug, then give it another go (after working out what
your oil ratio should have been and dilutiong the existing mixed fuel to
suit)

Cheers, Nige

[Noddy]

"Ben Thomas" <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote in message
news:4nivrc.adq.ln@192.168.11.2...

> Any ideas?

Take the head off and have a look down the bore, but from what you've said
it sounds as if it didn't have enough oil and has "put in a short one".

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Bob Saccamano]

"Nige" <post@it.in.thegroup> wrote in message
news:41e35abe_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
> sounds like you've flooded it rather than seized it (actually running way
to
> rich). The black sooty stuff would have been white if you were running to
> lean.

Even when flooded, you should still be able to turn the motor. If the motor
does'nt turn with the sparkplug out, either the starter pully mechanism is
faulty, or the motor is fooked.
>

[Bob Saccamano]

"Ben Thomas" <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote in message
news:4nivrc.adq.ln@192.168.11.2...
> Hi all,
>
> I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I thought
was a
> correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according to the
instructions)
> but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't restart. It actually
seems
> jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.

If its one of those cheap asian peices of shit, then I'm not surprised.

>
> I took out the spark plug and the white ceramic part has a black sooty
coating.

Faily normal, those little 2 strokes are oily buggers, even with the correct
mix. Is it overly wet? Clean, dry and restart.

>
> I wasn't running it flat out (but probably close to it) or trying to cut
through
> heavy grass or fence posts, etc.

Should'nt matter. Execpt with those cheap asian peices of shit.

>
> Any ideas?

What mix did you use? 20/25:1?

Did you use correct 2 stroke oil?

Can you turn the motor with the spark plug out? If not, its fooked.

You should not have to let the thing cool down for the motor to turn over.
Somethings wrong. Unless its one of those cheap asian peices of shit. You
get the idea.

[Chris]

Would you even waste the time? You can get a brand new whipper snipper from
Bunnings for about $150, and it'll be made by John Deere, and have a 2 year
domestic warranty! Had mine for about 4 years now, and never missed a beat!
CKL
"Noddy" <dg4163@(nospam)dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:41e35e7b$1@news.comindico.com.au...
>
> Take the head off and have a look down the bore, but from what you've said
> it sounds as if it didn't have enough oil and has "put in a short one".
>
> --
> Regards,
> Noddy.
>
>

[Patrick Young]

Chris wrote:
> Would you even waste the time? You can get a brand new whipper snipper from
> Bunnings for about $150, and it'll be made by John Deere, and have a 2 year
> domestic warranty! Had mine for about 4 years now, and never missed a beat!

Urmmm, Talon AT330132 (32cc) $169. Pity it comes with the 25cc user
guide...

Smelly, bloody noisy 2 stroke petrol engines ;-)

[John_H]

Ben Thomas wrote:

>
>I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I thought was a
>correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according to the instructions)
>but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't restart. It actually seems
>jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.

FWIW, almost any new 2-stroke needs tuning before it's put it work.
If it's a reputable brand the dealer should've done it as part of the
pre-delivery service. If it isn't you'll need to do it yourself or
find someone else who can.

High performance 2-strokes are sensitive to altitude, type of oil and
the fuel:oil ratio -- which is why the can't be accurately tuned ex
factory. Also means you've gotta mix your fuel with care.

>
>I took out the spark plug and the white ceramic part has a black sooty coating.

If it hasn't been tuned the chances are it's running way too rich and
pooped up the spark plug. Take out the plug and make sure it spins
over without it. While you're at it connect up the plug (out of the
engine but earthed to the fins or similar) and see if there's a spark
across the electrodes -- if not you'll need to shout it a new plug
before you go any further (don't bugger about trying to clean a
2-stroke plug).

>
>I wasn't running it flat out (but probably close to it) or trying to cut through
>heavy grass or fence posts, etc.

Better to run it flat out. It'll also give you an idea of how close
the mixture is... if it four strokes it's too rich.... if it over revs
it's too lean. Should make a healthy 2-stroke sound with a light
stream of blue smoke from the exhaust.

>
>Any ideas?

If the foregoing isn't absolutely clear you'll probably need to find
yourself a small engine mechanic (preferably one who specialises in
chainsaws and the likes).

--
John H

[Patrick Young]

Ben Thomas wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I
> thought was a correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according
> to the instructions) but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't
> restart. It actually seems jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.

This was a *new* unit, just purchased?

What brand?

It has been my recent experience with a number of new goods that you
have to actually rebuild them yourself before 1st use.

The new 12v DC air compressor I recently bought to stock the Hilux,
being a good example. During assembly they got the power cord polarity
the wrong way around so the crank would unscrew from the motor shaft
and lock up the motor, and didn't even bother greasing the thing!?!?!?

Runs like a charm _now_.

[John_H]

Patrick Young wrote:

>
>The new 12v DC air compressor I recently bought to stock the Hilux,
>being a good example. During assembly they got the power cord polarity
>the wrong way around so the crank would unscrew from the motor shaft
>and lock up the motor, and didn't even bother greasing the thing!?!?!?

I'm told that serious off-roaders make theirs from a/c compressors...
belt driven off the engine.

Also needs a reservoir if you need to seat tubeless tyres (most
serious off-roaders do).... Knowing that you wouldn't think much of
the petrol method. :)

--
John H

[Patrick Young]

John_H wrote:

> Patrick Young wrote:
>
>>The new 12v DC air compressor I recently bought to stock the Hilux,
>>being a good example. During assembly they got the power cord polarity
>>the wrong way around so the crank would unscrew from the motor shaft
>>and lock up the motor, and didn't even bother greasing the thing!?!?!?
>
> I'm told that serious off-roaders make theirs from a/c compressors...
> belt driven off the engine.

I'm not a serious offroader, I just need my 4x4 to work when no one
else is around in an area other people could be around if called
upon (if the mobile phone worked, which is questionable) not
going on an epic journey here, although I'd like to.

The 12V unit was used on a daily basis and worked well _AFTER_
I'd fixed it.

With the Hilux there is a huge voltage drop with the cig. socket,
so now use it directly to the battery.

> Also needs a reservoir if you need to seat tubeless tyres (most
> serious off-roaders do).... Knowing that you wouldn't think much of
> the petrol method. :)

Actually I suck at breaking a tyre from a rim, patching a tube
(as I recently found out, just last week with a dirt bike tyre).

Did it but still leaked, prolly crimped it putting the mess back
together. At least the repaired compressor could inflate it.

Pointers would be appreciated.

[The Raven]

"Noddy" <dg4163@(nospam)dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:41e35e7b$1@news.comindico.com.au...
>
> "Ben Thomas" <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote in message
> news:4nivrc.adq.ln@192.168.11.2...
>
>> Any ideas?
>
> Take the head off and have a look down the bore, but from what you've said
> it sounds as if it didn't have enough oil and has "put in a short one".

Most don't have separate cylinder heads, they are cast as part of the
cylinder. However, I agree it sounds like not enough oil and now it's
seized.


--
The Raven
http://www.80scartoons.co.uk/batfinkquote.mp3
** Now I will bring chaos to the world!

[The Raven]

"Ben Thomas" <nosp@m.thanks.mate> wrote in message
news:4nivrc.adq.ln@192.168.11.2...
> Hi all,
>
> I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I thought
> was a correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according to the
> instructions) but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't restart.
> It actually seems jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.

That's seized. You didn't use the right oil or the right amount. The normal
ratios you encounter are 25:1 or 50:1, the later being more for emissions
than anything. I'm amazed at how many people get the mix calculation so
wrong.

How much oil do you need for a litre of fuel if the mix is 25:1?

> I took out the spark plug and the white ceramic part has a black sooty
> coating.

Doesn't mean much in itself.

>
> I wasn't running it flat out (but probably close to it) or trying to cut
> through heavy grass or fence posts, etc.
>
> Any ideas?

See if Big W still has the special on the Homelite F2020 for $89.

If your dead one is an F2020, I'll take it off your hands for $20. I have an
alternative use for these engines and you won't get much more than that for
it as the repairs will cost more than it's worth.

BTW I noticed that Ryobi is now using the Homelite 25cc engine in some of
it's models. Did you know Homelite is a division of John Deere?

The Ryobi or Homelite engines are pretty good compared to some of the crap
I've had to fix because the owners forgot to add oil to the fuel. Real
bearings, real rods and counter balanced cranks. Can't believe some of the
no-name models have rods made from nothing more than rivetted stacks of
stamped tin!

Anyone with a dead whipper snipper? I'm after the Walbro carbs off them.

--
The Raven
http://www.80scartoons.co.uk/batfinkquote.mp3
** Now I will bring chaos to the world!

[Toby Ponsenby]

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 20:42:41 +1100, The Raven wrote:

> Anyone with a dead whipper snipper? I'm after the Walbro carbs off them.

????
Curious as to what the hell Walbro's are good for other than fueling
wee engines. Aeration system somewhere?

And don't forget Shindaiwa. Top machinery IMHO.
They do get counterbalanced cranks, and many have survived seizing due
cocked up mix or stale fuel just fine.

--
Toby
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur

[Rainbow Warrior]

"Chris" <someone@microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:41e360c8$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
> Would you even waste the time?

Just to see what's in there.

> You can get a brand new whipper snipper from
> Bunnings for about $150, and it'll be made by John Deere, and have a 2
year
> domestic warranty! Had mine for about 4 years now, and never missed a
beat!

You spent too much, I paid $99 at Bunnings for a Ryobi Scorpion, had it for
4 years, never missed a beat, starts first time everytime.
Beauty of Electricity.

> CKL

JTL

> "Noddy" <dg4163@(nospam)dodo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:41e35e7b$1@news.comindico.com.au...
> >
> > Take the head off and have a look down the bore, but from what you've
said
> > it sounds as if it didn't have enough oil and has "put in a short one".
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> > Noddy.
> >
> >
>
>

[Rainbow Warrior]

"John_H" <john4271@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:68q6u0hn0fgl0gs8cd31ua4146ajlr0du9@4ax.com...
> Ben Thomas wrote:
>
> >I used my 2 stroke whipper snipper for the first time, with what I
thought was a
> >correct mix of 2 stroke oil and unleaded petrol (according to the
instructions)
> >but after about 20 minutes it stopped and now won't restart. It actually
seems
> >jammed as I can't pull the rip cord out at all.
>
> FWIW, almost any new 2-stroke needs tuning before it's put it work.
> If it's a reputable brand the dealer should've done it as part of the
> pre-delivery service. If it isn't you'll need to do it yourself or
> find someone else who can.

3 million odd Victa's must be stuffed.

> High performance 2-strokes are sensitive to altitude, type of oil and
> the fuel:oil ratio -- which is why the can't be accurately tuned ex
> factory. Also means you've gotta mix your fuel with care.

The average mower seems to handle the average Joes "precise" mixing quite
well.

[Rainbow Warrior]

"John_H" <john4271@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:to27u0dgbo4omnmu49n05f0n8uko2detfv@4ax.com...
> Patrick Young wrote:
>
> >
> >The new 12v DC air compressor I recently bought to stock the Hilux,
> >being a good example. During assembly they got the power cord polarity
> >the wrong way around so the crank would unscrew from the motor shaft
> >and lock up the motor, and didn't even bother greasing the thing!?!?!?
>
> I'm told that serious off-roaders make theirs from a/c compressors...
> belt driven off the engine.
>
> Also needs a reservoir if you need to seat tubeless tyres (most
> serious off-roaders do).... Knowing that you wouldn't think much of
> the petrol method. :)
>
> John H

Some of us just run 240V compressors from inverters instead :-)

[Patrick Young]

Rainbow Warrior wrote:
> "John_H" <john4271@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:to27u0dgbo4omnmu49n05f0n8uko2detfv@4ax.com...
>
>>Patrick Young wrote:
>>
>>
>>>The new 12v DC air compressor I recently bought to stock the Hilux,
>>>being a good example. During assembly they got the power cord polarity
>>>the wrong way around so the crank would unscrew from the motor shaft
>>>and lock up the motor, and didn't even bother greasing the thing!?!?!?
>>
>>I'm told that serious off-roaders make theirs from a/c compressors...
>>belt driven off the engine.
>>
>>Also needs a reservoir if you need to seat tubeless tyres (most
>>serious off-roaders do).... Knowing that you wouldn't think much of
>>the petrol method. :)
>>
>>John H
>
>
> Some of us just run 240V compressors from inverters instead :-)
>

Nice try. I don't think so :-), what was the part # on that MOSFET ?!!?

[Rainbow Warrior]

"Patrick Young" <patrick@hilux.ace.unsw.EDU.AU> wrote in message
news:34hnibF4a8knoU1@individual.net...
> Rainbow Warrior wrote:
> > "John_H" <john4271@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:to27u0dgbo4omnmu49n05f0n8uko2detfv@4ax.com...
> >
> >>Patrick Young wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>The new 12v DC air compressor I recently bought to stock the Hilux,
> >>>being a good example. During assembly they got the power cord polarity
> >>>the wrong way around so the crank would unscrew from the motor shaft
> >>>and lock up the motor, and didn't even bother greasing the thing!?!?!?
> >>
> >>I'm told that serious off-roaders make theirs from a/c compressors...
> >>belt driven off the engine.
> >>
> >>Also needs a reservoir if you need to seat tubeless tyres (most
> >>serious off-roaders do).... Knowing that you wouldn't think much of
> >>the petrol method. :)
> >>
> >>John H
> >
> > Some of us just run 240V compressors from inverters instead :-)
>
> Nice try. I don't think so :-), what was the part # on that MOSFET ?!!?

You Jest? You have no idea what you can run off a 1700w Inverter :-)
The fridge, TV, Video & box fan are a good start in a 6 hour blackout.
My 240v compressor pumps the tyres up real good in the bush.

[Patrick Young]

Rainbow Warrior wrote:
> "Patrick Young" <patrick@hilux.ace.unsw.EDU.AU> wrote in message
> news:34hnibF4a8knoU1@individual.net...

>>Nice try. I don't think so :-), what was the part # on that MOSFET ?!!?

> You Jest? You have no idea what you can run off a 1700w Inverter :-)
> The fridge, TV, Video & box fan are a good start in a 6 hour blackout.
> My 240v compressor pumps the tyres up real good in the bush.

Feck! Make and model pleeeze? Recently had to disconnect
friend's next door neighbour's TV degaussing coil to prevent
inverter blowing fuse for their xmas trip.



>