Commodore VS LPG/Petrol help

[LeFtBehinD]

Hi guys,

Im new to these forums but I was just looking for some advice if anyone can give it to me.

Im really interested in purchasing a Used Commodore VS that has only had one previous owner and done 110,000km.

Thing is I dont know much about Duel Fuel, which the car has. Ive heard some ppl say that running Gas can do serious damage to your engine and can end up costing more than you save. Is this true at all? I should also mention that it wasnt factory fitted but has been done by a gas specialist. Is there a way that your supposed to run a Duel Fuel car? (i.e. LPG 3 tanks to 1 Petrol tank.)

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

[Toby Ponsenby]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:53:48 +1100, LeFtBehinD wrote:

> Im really interested in purchasing a Used Commodore VS that has only
> had one previous owner and done 110,000km.

Freddos Firewalled Cabs Pty Ltd.
And that'd be 1,110,000 Kms.


--
Toby
quidquid latine dictum
sit, altum viditur

[LeFtBehinD]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:53:48 +1100, LeFtBehinD wrote:


Freddos Firewalled Cabs Pty Ltd.
And that'd be 1,110,000 Kms.


If thats a joke please dont cause im really after some help here.

[DalienX]

LeFtBehinD wrote:

>
> Hi guys,
>
> Im new to these forums but I was just looking for some advice if anyone
> can give it to me.
>
> Im really interested in purchasing a Used Commodore VS that has only
> had one previous owner and done 110,000km.
>
> Thing is I dont know much about Duel Fuel, which the car has. Ive heard
> some ppl say that running Gas can do serious damage to your engine and
> can end up costing more than you save. Is this true at all? I should
> also mention that it wasnt factory fitted but has been done by a gas
> specialist. Is there a way that your supposed to run a Duel Fuel car?
> (i.e. LPG 3 tanks to 1 Petrol tank.)
>
> Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

I am not a fan of lpg, and duel fuel is even worse, on the other hand the ks are
rather low for the cars age.
If you want my advise, take it for a test drive on petrol, if the motor still feels
nice and strong then buy it and get the gas uninstalled.
With the current price of gas, it doesnt save much money anyway.

--
DalienX

[Serialpest]

On 21/2/05 3:53 PM, in article LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au,
"LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote:

>
> Hi guys,
>
> Im new to these forums but I was just looking for some advice if anyone
> can give it to me.
>
> Im really interested in purchasing a Used Commodore VS that has only
> had one previous owner and done 110,000km.
>
> Thing is I dont know much about Duel Fuel, which the car has. Ive heard
> some ppl say that running Gas can do serious damage to your engine and
> can end up costing more than you save. Is this true at all? I should
> also mention that it wasnt factory fitted but has been done by a gas
> specialist. Is there a way that your supposed to run a Duel Fuel car?
> (i.e. LPG 3 tanks to 1 Petrol tank.)
>
> Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
My advice:

1. VS commodores were not a good model.

2. they run terrible on gas.

[D Walford]

LeFtBehinD wrote:
>
> Toby Ponsenby Wrote:
> > On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:53:48 +1100, LeFtBehinD wrote:
> >
> >
> > Freddos Firewalled Cabs Pty Ltd.
> > And that'd be 1,110,000 Kms.
> >
>
> If thats a joke please dont cause im really after some help here.
>


It does seem odd that a car converted to run on gas has done so few
klms, gas conversions are usually done by people who do above average
klms.
Assuming the klms are genuine there is no reason why an LPG car won't
last as long as one running on petrol in fact it should last longer as
LPG don't dirty their oil as quickly.
V6 Commodores on gas have a reputation for backfiring which can cause
expensive damage to the airbox although this problem can be minimised by
careful maintenance of the ignition system.
Its a good idea to run the car on petrol once a week to keep the fuel
injectors in good order.
The cost saving on fuel is well worth any minor disadvantages.


Daryl

[LeFtBehinD]

Assuming the klms are genuine there is no reason why an LPG car won't
last as long as one running on petrol in fact it should last longer as
LPG don't dirty their oil as quickly.
V6 Commodores on gas have a reputation for backfiring which can cause
expensive damage to the airbox although this problem can be minimised by
careful maintenance of the ignition system.
Its a good idea to run the car on petrol once a week to keep the fuel
injectors in good order.
The cost saving on fuel is well worth any minor disadvantages.

Thats what i was sorta hoping for. When you say "careful maintenance of the ignition system" is that anything I can do, cause I dont really know much about cars. And I plan to run every couple of tanks on petrol as they say its good for the engine.

[Noddy]

"LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote in message
news:LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-

> Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

The best advice I could give you would be to stay away from any Commodore V6
on gas unless you're willing to put money into sorting it out, as they're
probably one of the worst cars on lpg you can get.

LPG itself doesn't cause damage to engines, in fact, engines running on lpg
have far superior longevity than those on petrol on the whole. However, LPG
as an automotive fuel has some peculiarities that show themselves in strange
ways on some cars, and one of those is violent backfires.

The Commodore V6 is famous for this, and it's often quite destructive when
it happens. Destruction of the air filter box is usually the norm, but it
also can and often does damage other components which can be pretty costly.
The "explosion" is also so loud that it scares the bejesus out of everyone
in the car, and all those within a 40 foot radius :)

The fix isn't often simple, and some people seem to have dedicated their
lives to getting it "right".

If you decide to buy the car, the first thing I would recommend you do would
be to obtain the best set of ignition leads money can buy, and run your
spark plugs with a gap of no more than 35 thousandths of an inch. I'd also
give some *serious* thought to investing in a set of quality valve springs
with a higher than standard on seat pressure, and having them fitted.

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[atec]

DalienX wrote:
> LeFtBehinD wrote:
>
>
>>Hi guys,
>>
>>Im new to these forums but I was just looking for some advice if anyone
>>can give it to me.
>>
>>Im really interested in purchasing a Used Commodore VS that has only
>>had one previous owner and done 110,000km.
>>
>>Thing is I dont know much about Duel Fuel, which the car has. Ive heard
>>some ppl say that running Gas can do serious damage to your engine and
>>can end up costing more than you save. Is this true at all? I should
>>also mention that it wasnt factory fitted but has been done by a gas
>>specialist. Is there a way that your supposed to run a Duel Fuel car?
>>(i.e. LPG 3 tanks to 1 Petrol tank.)
>>
>>Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
>
> I am not a fan of lpg, and duel fuel is even worse, on the other hand the ks are
> rather low for the cars age.
> If you want my advise, take it for a test drive on petrol, if the motor still feels
> nice and strong then buy it and get the gas uninstalled.
that is some of the worst advice ever , nfi have you ( and its rhetorical)
> With the current price of gas, it doesnt save much money anyway.
>

[atec]

D Walford wrote:
> LeFtBehinD wrote:
>
>>Toby Ponsenby Wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:53:48 +1100, LeFtBehinD wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>Freddos Firewalled Cabs Pty Ltd.
>>>And that'd be 1,110,000 Kms.
>>>
>>
>>If thats a joke please dont cause im really after some help here.
>>
>
>
>
> It does seem odd that a car converted to run on gas has done so few
> klms, gas conversions are usually done by people who do above average
> klms.
> Assuming the klms are genuine there is no reason why an LPG car won't
> last as long as one running on petrol in fact it should last longer as
> LPG don't dirty their oil as quickly.
> V6 Commodores on gas have a reputation for backfiring which can cause
> expensive damage to the airbox although this problem can be minimised by
> careful maintenance of the ignition system.
or the added flap mod , costs about $10.00
> Its a good idea to run the car on petrol once a week to keep the fuel
> injectors in good order.
> The cost saving on fuel is well worth any minor disadvantages.
>
>
> Daryl

[Cijena]

Hi,

I have had my V6 2000 VX on gas for the last year and havent had any
problems. I made sure that it was a holden endorsed kit.

It is recommended that you run the car on petrol every 30-45 days for about
20 litres... I usually run the car on petrol every weekend.

The service interval for just the lpg unit specified by Holden is every
10,000ks....

My commodore costs me about $85 on average per month for 2500ks in gas.

Hope this helps...
"Noddy" <dg4163@_nospam_dod.com.au> wrote in message
news:421999d2$1@news.comindico.com.au...
>
> "LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-
>
>> Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
> The best advice I could give you would be to stay away from any Commodore
> V6 on gas unless you're willing to put money into sorting it out, as
> they're probably one of the worst cars on lpg you can get.
>
> LPG itself doesn't cause damage to engines, in fact, engines running on
> lpg have far superior longevity than those on petrol on the whole.
> However, LPG as an automotive fuel has some peculiarities that show
> themselves in strange ways on some cars, and one of those is violent
> backfires.
>
> The Commodore V6 is famous for this, and it's often quite destructive when
> it happens. Destruction of the air filter box is usually the norm, but it
> also can and often does damage other components which can be pretty
> costly. The "explosion" is also so loud that it scares the bejesus out of
> everyone in the car, and all those within a 40 foot radius :)
>
> The fix isn't often simple, and some people seem to have dedicated their
> lives to getting it "right".
>
> If you decide to buy the car, the first thing I would recommend you do
> would be to obtain the best set of ignition leads money can buy, and run
> your spark plugs with a gap of no more than 35 thousandths of an inch. I'd
> also give some *serious* thought to investing in a set of quality valve
> springs with a higher than standard on seat pressure, and having them
> fitted.
>
> --
> Regards,
> Noddy.
>

[D Walford]

LeFtBehinD wrote:
>
>
> Thats what i was sorta hoping for. When you say "careful maintenance of
> the ignition system" is that anything I can do, cause I dont really
> know much about cars. And I plan to run every couple of tanks on petrol
> as they say its good for the engine.
>

Replace spark plugs more frequently than Holden recommend and fit a very
good quality set of plugs leads eg Magnacor.
To overcome the cost of new air boxes if the engine backfires you can
install a "flap" in the airbox which is secured by duct tape or a
spring, if the engine does backfire it just blows out the flap which can
be simply retaped or the spring will reclose it.
20klms a week on petrol is probably enough, many EFI LPG equipped cars
start on petrol and then switch to gas when the accelerator is pressed
so it gets some petrol everytime the engine is started.



Daryl

[Clockmeister]

"LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote in message
news:LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au...
>
> Hi guys,
>
> Im new to these forums but I was just looking for some advice if anyone
> can give it to me.
>
> Im really interested in purchasing a Used Commodore VS that has only
> had one previous owner and done 110,000km.
>
> Thing is I dont know much about Duel Fuel, which the car has. Ive heard
> some ppl say that running Gas can do serious damage to your engine and
> can end up costing more than you save. Is this true at all? I should
> also mention that it wasnt factory fitted but has been done by a gas
> specialist. Is there a way that your supposed to run a Duel Fuel car?
> (i.e. LPG 3 tanks to 1 Petrol tank.)
>
> Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
>

Mostly it has already been covered by other replies but the VS did have
issues with wearing valve guides and that is only made worse by using LPG so
that is something to consider if purchasing a low k VS (if low k LPG VS's
exist, I would think not).

Higher mileage vehicles should already have had the guides replaced with
better ones if they were to be an issue. Check for lumpy idle which may
indicate valve guide problems.

[Graham W]

> On 21/2/05 3:53 PM, in article LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au,
> "LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote:
>>Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Serialpest wrote:
> My advice:
>
> 1. VS commodores were not a good model.
>
> 2. they run terrible on gas.

Read a selection of serialpest's other posts before placing any weight
on his advice. There's a reason he calls himself serialpest.

[OzOne]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 01:46:11 +1100, Graham W
<zebedee@alphalink.commercial.au> scribbled thusly:

>> On 21/2/05 3:53 PM, in article LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au,
>> "LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote:
>>>Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Serialpest wrote:
>> My advice:
>>
>> 1. VS commodores were not a good model.
>>
>> 2. they run terrible on gas.
>
>Read a selection of serialpest's other posts before placing any weight
>on his advice. There's a reason he calls himself serialpest.

Graham, have you read the other advice by people who know?

Yep, that's right....the VS Commodore was not a good model, and yes,
they had plenty of problems on gas.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

[Jac]

"LeFtBehinD" <LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au> wrote in message
news:LeFtBehinD.1kshv0@no-mx.forums.eyo.com.au...

> Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
>
> --
> LeFtBehinD

I've had my VS for 216k trouble free kms (no towing, waterpump, idle pulleys
and thermostat replaced) and 100k of that has been on gas.

The only time I had backfires was due to faulty plugs and a faulty lead. 3
backfires in 4 years of driving. I dropped the plug gaps down to .8mm but to
be honest, I had no backfires before that when the plugs were ok.

I did drill a few holes in my airbox and put duct tape over the top to stop
my box from breaking apart but since I attended to the issues, I've not had
another backfire.

At over $1000 a year saving on fuel costs, I'm more than happy to put up
with the (rare) occasion where I need to look at the ignition system.

I do run petrol once a week for 20-30 kms (trip into work) and have had no
symptoms suggesting valve guide wear. Having said that, I'm about $2500 up
after 4 years so I'm sure near guides won't cost anywhere near that amount.

VS's do have weak tranmissions and certainly aren't the most refined piece
of motoring but I've looked after mine and she's returned the favour.

Regards

Jac

[Jac]

"DalienX" <somewhere@earth.com> wrote in message
news:PkgSd.169631$K7.156980@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> LeFtBehinD wrote:

> I am not a fan of lpg, and duel fuel is even worse, on the other hand the
> ks are
> rather low for the cars age.
> If you want my advise, take it for a test drive on petrol, if the motor
> still feels
> nice and strong then buy it and get the gas uninstalled.
> With the current price of gas, it doesnt save much money anyway.
>
> --
> DalienX

What's the price of gas near you?

It's less than 50% petrol costs at the moment here ( 40 cents vs $1.00)

Jac

[DalienX]

Jac wrote:

>
> "DalienX" <somewhere@earth.com> wrote in message
> news:PkgSd.169631$K7.156980@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> > LeFtBehinD wrote:
>
> > I am not a fan of lpg, and duel fuel is even worse, on the other hand the
> > ks are
> > rather low for the cars age.
> > If you want my advise, take it for a test drive on petrol, if the motor
> > still feels
> > nice and strong then buy it and get the gas uninstalled.
> > With the current price of gas, it doesnt save much money anyway.
> >
> > --
> > DalienX
>
> What's the price of gas near you?
>
> It's less than 50% petrol costs at the moment here ( 40 cents vs $1.00)
>
> Jac

LPG here is about 45 cents vs 92 cents for unleaded
Taking into acccount that gas gets used roughly twice as fast..
Our old duel fuel work car used to go though an entire tank of lpg per night
(40litre tank), or a tank of petrol would last it about 3 nights (6o litre tank).

--
DalienX

[DalienX]

OzOne wrote:


>
> Yep, that's right....the VS Commodore was not a good model, and yes,
> they had plenty of problems on gas.
>
>

Actualy your only half right, the VS was a great model and yes, ALL cars have
problems on gas.


--
DalienX

[atec]

DalienX wrote:
> Jac wrote:
>
>
>>"DalienX" <somewhere@earth.com> wrote in message
>>news:PkgSd.169631$K7.156980@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>>
>>>LeFtBehinD wrote:
>>
>>>I am not a fan of lpg, and duel fuel is even worse, on the other hand the
>>>ks are
>>>rather low for the cars age.
>>>If you want my advise, take it for a test drive on petrol, if the motor
>>>still feels
>>>nice and strong then buy it and get the gas uninstalled.
>>>With the current price of gas, it doesnt save much money anyway.
>>>
>>>--
>>>DalienX
>>
>>What's the price of gas near you?
>>
>>It's less than 50% petrol costs at the moment here ( 40 cents vs $1.00)
>>
>>Jac
>
>
> LPG here is about 45 cents vs 92 cents for unleaded
> Taking into acccount that gas gets used roughly twice as fast..
> Our old duel fuel work car used to go though an entire tank of lpg per night
BBZZZTTTTT WRONG
> (40litre tank), or a tank of petrol would last it about 3 nights (6o litre tank).
both the foulcans here on gas run in normal use about 14.5 /100 ,
>